And look, Mark, your work does center on themes of, like, solitude and nostalgia, so what draws you to these quiet spaces, uh, especially 'cause you live in a pretty busy city like Melbourne?

I think I'm drawn to the spaces that I enjoy shooting from a few different aspects.

I think there's, first of all, there's the pure aesthetic impact of what you're photographing in terms of how it will come out in an image.

Obviously, how the light interacts with the scene.

Um, and I know [laughs] that... well, I'm, I'm expecting that a lot of street photographers when they go and see a bright, sunny day, that makes them happy because they love...

You love a shadow and you love what else.

But, but I'm the opposite.

So what has photography taught you over the years?

Mm

...

I was actually commissioned to shoot a historic building, um, that had been, uh, was coming back to a council in Australia's possession, um, and it had been away from them for 15 years on a loan to someone else or another- ... school, a school.

Um, and then they were getting it back and, um, so they wanted me to go in and document the building.

So the brief literally was, "We want you to go in and document the building and make three pieces out of it," that, that they were gonna then use on these really big, like, three meter by three meter-ish light boxes.

So that was, like, the, the presentation to show that people in the local area this po- possession was, I guess, back in, um, you know, local council's hands.

Um, so my brief was just open.

And then you're collecting.

Can you define the difference in how they work?

Yeah, obviously, we sort of, I suppose, put a cover over the whole thing and call it disordered eating.

But sure, there's anorexia.

And, you know, I've seen young girls who are frightened to sit beside somebody drinking water because this is the mindset they're that comes about because they're thinking that they're going to gain the molecules are going to come out of her skin land on mine and I'm going to absorb this.

That's how powerful this mindset can be.

So when you understand that too, this is not something that they're acting out or putting on.

This is their belief sets that have the eating disorders as where it's taken them to.

Can you go over, because we are getting, time-wise we're getting up there unfortunately, but can you go over a little bit, because I know there's another two stages to this and there's a whole bunch of other stuff going on, but there's another two stages that you've put together you've seen a need for to make this work effectively.