Ym, a beth oedd y rheswm am hynny? Be-beth oedd pobl yn dweud wrthych chi ar stepen y drws wrth bod chi, croch-- wel, i, i ddechra gyda llaw, beth o'ch chi'n dweud? Ym, "I'm calling on behalf of Andy Burnham," neu "I'm calling on behalf of Labour"?

Uh, galw ar ran Andy Burnham.

Dyna beth oedd y neges.

Uh, dyna beth oedd y, y ffordd oedd pobl oedd yn rhedeg ar ymdrech yn eisiau ni wneud e. Wel, chi ddim yn cwrdd gyda lot o bobl mewn un, uh, diwrnod, ac oedden ni'n mynd nôl i, uh, strydoedd ble oedd Plaid Lafur wedi bod 'na tair waith, uh, o flaen, ac oedden ni jyst yn galw ar drwsiau ble oedd neb i fewn, uh, tro cynta a'r ail tro a'r trydydd tro, so yr unig beth i'n gwybod amdanyn nhw oedd eu dim, dydyn nhw ddim [chwerthin] yn gartre lot.

[chwerthin] Ond, uh, y, y drws cynta, uh, o-o rhywun, mae nhw'n, uh, rhedeg y bwrdd ac yn dweud, "Cerwch chi nawr i drws pump." Yr unig beth oedden ni'n gwybod am-andanyn nhw, uh, Ceidwadwyr ydyn nhw, uh, yn y tymor.

So es i, es i lan, cer drws.

Oedd rhywun hen yn dod, uh, hen fenyw oedd hi'n, mm, siŵr o fod yn agosau i naw deg neu wyth deg a oed.

Uh, ond ydy hynny yn beryg go iawn yn eich tŷ chi?

Um, it, it w- there is a huge potential for, for further devolution if that was the mindset of a UK government.

Yes.

Well, look, that is the starting point, isn't it? And that's why it's important to say, if the Senedd wants it, because the Senedd would need to know that it could absorb new responsibilities, you know, and, and to do that in an orderly way that gives you time to get used to new responsibilities.

So, you know, I imagine that Andy Burnham's starting point will be the things to which the Labor Party in Wales is already committed and to which an extent appeared in the 2024 general election manifesto, devolution of youth justice, probation, and policing, given the changes proposed in policing.

That will be a very good start.

In relation to justice, those are the powers that are already closest to the things the Senedd does anyway.

A pathway on the Crown Estate.

Um, do you think this is something that could happen? Would you wanna see it happen? Do you think he would have an appetite for that?

Do you think it speaks to this commentary that he's not a politician at the, you know, the end of his fingertips, and that he didn't have a big vision, and that he was managerial and actually a bit of a technocrat, and so he wasn't sure of his own mind, so that's maybe why you didn't see the real Keir Starmer?

Starmer?Well, look, what we expect of a prime minister is extraordinary.

In terms of the skill set we expect them, uh, to have, and the fact that any one individual will never be able to tick every box that you look for is not that surprising, is it? I don't think those criticisms are completely fair.

I, I attended the very first meeting of a shadow cabinet after he had become Labour leader, and I didn't go to many shadow cabinet meetings as they were always on the wrong day.

They were always on a Tuesday where we were busy doing other things.

But as it happened, I was a-able to go to that.

You-- That day, I thought he was very impressive.

And I mean, we don't have to relitigate all of it, but you, you'll know, you'll, you'll know the charge, right? Uh, you know, as someone from that wing of the party, I mean, how do you see it?

He's a big believer in parties with shared values working together but thinks Labor's revival does require a change at the top too.

If you were on the doorstep, as I was, throughout the month of April, there is just no doubt that the prime minister no longer has the confidence, uh, of people who elected Labor less than two years ago.

I will be in the Makerfield by-election campaigning for, uh, an Andy Burnham victory, and I hope that he will succeed there, and I hope he will put his hat into the ring to be our next prime minister.

This is about something quite fundamental about the, the policy offer" that this government, in his view, has failed to come up with so far.

Well, I myself always much more interested in policy than I am in personalities, uh, in politics.

But in order to get a new policy direction, I think you probably do need a new leader at the helm in Downing Street who can make that new program matter.

One of the problems for the prime minister is that his future has been so long under discussion, uh, that I don't think Downing Street can operate effectively.

His word just doesn't run through Whitehall or through Westminster.