What's the rationale? Why is there a real goal and mission to

keep things tight? I personally think that the charity sector is, in some ways...

sort of lost sight of what it's here to do and that's not necessarily the sector's fault or individuals in the sector's fault but you know really like charities should be trying to do themselves out of a job we shouldn't have to exist and you know therefore the idea that we keep growing and we kind of have a growth mindset is a bit is a bit counterintuitive really so you know every year we're saying to ourselves you know will this be the year we can make ourselves redundant unfortunately That's not the case.

People need us more than ever, unfortunately.

And, you know, there is an argument that, as I was saying before, about, you know, the brokerage and the kind of joining the dots.

I think that will always be necessary just because of how fast we operate these days and with technology and things like that as well to enable but also kind of disconnect us.

It's also about efficiency.

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