I mean, I've been on his side before and it's tough when you don't know what's going on.

Yeah, and I was sort of the one more so making the adaptions and things like that because I understood it more.

So I was looking at...

And I say more Finn in particular, actually, more than Poppy.

Though Terry would probably disagree and say there's some PDA with me as well.

Not in Kent, Lisa, not in Kent.

No, not in Kent.

So how is it for you?

process like for getting their diagnosis over the last few

years? So...

With both of them, it's a very different story because my boy was actually the one who's good at masking and he's intelligent, he's academic, very well behaved.

And so it took quite a long time to get a diagnosis for him.

It took about four years because nobody could see what was going on.

What could you see that they couldn't see? I knew he was different.

I knew the anxiety, which is what you talk about on your podcast.

So if you can't do it...

Can you take us there? Why was that?

Yeah.

Well, I think- I think especially as women, we learn to mask, neurodivergent women, our whole lives.

And I think we become so good at it that we actually don't even realize that we're doing it a lot of the time.

And in that session, I just s- said everything.

All these feelings that I'd kept inside for so long, all of my anxieties, all of the things that I'd been told at school, that I was, you know, naughty or, you know, that I was stupid, and all of these sort of labels that I'd been given throughout my life, which had affected me more than I realized.

You know, it's so easy to listen to the negative and, you know, dismiss the positives.

Um, how important is humor when talking about a topic that can be very deep and sensitive at times?

Shall we just say poop?

Yeah, all right then.

So I could smell poop, and it was really bizarre, so I think, "Well, go and check the toilet," you know.

I thought, "Well, it's definitely not me." Anyway, the next day, it wasn't poop.

It was toast.

And then, or was it toast first, then the poop? Anyway, it happened for three days in a row, and I was thinking, it's always, like, at the same time, same, you know, same sort of smells.

It came, it dissipated.

So you bring several entities home with you, and each one of them had, like, like, a different kind of pattern, a different personality, or could we surmise because it was an asylum, it was the different personalities of just one being?

But maybe we need something sustainable and long term and maybe thinking about some of this stuff has value.

Yeah.

And your word sustainable is a word that a lot of organisations are using now.

So everyone's looking at sustainable practice.

And so if we want to be sustainable, look at that across your organisation in terms of what we're doing.

Is our practice sustainable? And when then people shine a spotlight on what's going on.

that actually people are, you can't just keep pushing people to go faster and faster and loading more and more on people, expect them just to cope.

And again, it's about incentives.