So, um, what are your thoughts on fraternities? What does your research say about it? And what does it have to do with kind of the state of men?

So what's funny about fraternities, going back to my former advocacy work for girls and women, when- whenever I would think about fraternities, I thought of partying, all of those bad stories that always make the headlines, and you know, just had a negative view on fraternities.

[laughs] They were something that I was like, "Yeah, it's just a bunch of young men partying." Um, but then throughout the years over my advocacy work, I, I understood the importance of brotherhood, especially for young men.

That can carry over into their adult life.

So more recently, I actually got to know some of the people from Fraternities Know Men.

It's an organization, a collective of fraternities who...

They saw what was going on in the media, w- um, everybody talking about this crisis facing men and these loneliness outcomes and how they're staggering and, um, kind of being left behind.

Mm-hmm.