I

actually recently developed an exercise on how to draw boundaries.

And so the first thing to get in touch with really is what you need, right? What's good for you? oftentimes we just kind of go along with the program you know we just say yes and people ask us or we just think we're supposed to do this or we're supposed to do that or maybe our family's told us this it's really the first step is asking what is right for me you know do i really want to say yes or do i think i have to say yes right now obviously sometimes like as a parent sometimes you don't want to say yes but you have you part of you wants you because it's your child but sometimes actually you aren't doing it for authentic reasons you're doing it again either because you're afraid of the reaction of others or you're afraid people won't like you.

So identifying a boundary you want to draw, right? And then using, this is where the tender self-compassion comes in, almost like before the fear of self-compassion, being tender toward the feelings of fear that come up, sometimes the feeling of shame.

If our culture has shamed us, if we aren't like good self-sacrificing women, for instance, we may feel like shame if I don't say yes.

And so you got to hold all that stuff that is going to come up.

So you hold all that with that kindness and support, just like you would to a good friend.

so could you tell us and share with us one of the practices of self-compassion that you do

So what does the data show with how like self-compassion impacts like grit and performance and learning? Because I think a lot of people might worry they'll become like soft or complacent or something like that.

Yeah.

So I think people are presuming that the opposite of harsh self-criticism means like just not, you know, there's no problem, like just being nice or not pointing out any areas of improvement, just kind of making you feel good.

Well, if you're an athlete, that's not kind.

Right.

So if you're if you have something, an athlete or if you are in any sort of position that requires very a very high level of performance, the kindest thing you can do for yourself is to give yourself accurate feedback that you can understand, digest and make use of.

So the problem with self-criticism, especially because there's constructive criticism.

So how does offering ourselves self-compassion give us like emotional safety and needed to still kind of take responsibility and accountability in those situations?

And do you think when we experience more numbing of that emotions, it impacts what we were just talking about, that critical voice that we need to hear, the self-compassion that we need to feel, and how we respond to it?

Absolutely.

Well, some people numb themselves out in response to the inner critic.

A lot of people numb themselves out in response to trauma or in response to a lot of stress.

If you think of what we're doing when we numb ourselves...

And by the way, we aren't consciously choosing, "I'm gonna numb myself today." It's just the body's natural reaction when it's overwhelmed.

It just shuts down.

... self-compassion more in the household, what would be a way to start?

So could you tell us a little bit more about that one?

Right, yeah.

So you might say the... emotional tone of compassion is one of warmth and kindness right as opposed to being harsh or judgmental the way actually most of us are most of us tend not to be kind to ourselves especially when we've made a mistake um so so just just as compassion for a friend means you're kind and warm and supportive to that friend we're also kind and warm and supportive to ourselves um But it's more than kindness alone.

The reason it's compassion and not just kindness, the reason I didn't just call it self-kindness, is because there's two other elements.

One is actually mindfulness.

So I actually learned about self-compassion as part of my mindfulness meditation practice.

That's where I learned about it.

What do you think are, or what have you seen in studies that point to cultural or sociological roots of the tendency of harsh self-judgment?

So could you tell us a little bit more about that one?

Yeah, so you might say the emotional tone of compassion is one of warmth and kindness, right? As opposed to being harsh or judgmental the way actually most of us are.

Most of us tend not to be kind to ourselves, especially when we've made a mistake.

Just as compassion for a friend means you're kind and warm and supportive to that friend, we're also kind and warm and supportive to ourselves.

But it's more than kindness alone.

The reason it's compassion and not just kindness, the reason I didn't just call it self-kindness is because there's two other elements.

One is actually mindfulness.

But the good news is self-compassion can reverse those effects.

How did you feel about the diagnosis?

You know, I'm gonna be honest, a little disappointment.

It wasn't the plan I had signed up for.

You know, it wasn't, uh, you know, a lot of feelings of overwhelm.

Uh, and so, so part of it is focusing on my own feelings, but especially, this is, and this is so true with, for any parent or any, actually a leader dealing with [laughs] a meeting that's gone out of control.

What happens is when we're, when we're with other people who we're upset, and you know, one of the things about autism is my son would have these really big meltdowns because he'd go into sensory overload.

What happens when other people are feeling strong emotions is we feel them as well.

This playing field is not level, and it's not just you imagining this.

How did you feel about the diagnosis?

You know, I'm gonna be honest, a little disappointment.

It wasn't the plan I had signed up for.

You know, it wasn't, uh, you know, a lot of feelings of overwhelm.

Uh, and so, so part of it is focusing on my own feelings, but especially, this is, and this is so true with, for any parent or any, actually a leader dealing with [laughs] a meeting that's gone out of control.

What happens is when we're, when we're with other people who were upset, and you know, one of the things about autism is my son would have these really big meltdowns because he'd go into sensory overload.

What happens when other people are feeling strong emotions is we feel them as well.

This playing field is not level, and it's not just you imagining this.

I'm Dr. Pam King.

So you can close your eyes if you want.

You don't have to, but the idea is to go inward.

Maybe just settle into your body for a moment.

Feel your feet on the floor.

And just bring to mind something that you are struggling with right now.

It may be a work issue or relationship issue or something you feel badly about, health issue.

It doesn't

Dr. Neff, I would love for you to open this conversation up with what led you into the study of self-compassion and how this work has impacted your own journey.

Oh, sure.

Thank you so much for having me.

Um, yeah, well, for me, it was a personal journey.

It was actually my last year of graduate school.

I was at UC Berkeley.

Uh, and it was a really difficult time for me.

I'd love for us to talk about some kind of minimum effective dose practices, things that people could start to think about to ease into this place of self-compassion.

I love your geekiness.

Absolutely.

It's a very strong positive relationship between self-compassion and hope and optimism.

And so if you look at how it happens in real time.

So what happens normally is a negative thought or emotion comes, arises.

We identify with it.

We judge ourselves for having it or we judge the situation.

If you could give us a prescription, like one for each, whether it's a question you could ask yourself or a thing you could do, what would be what you would recommend for each of those three?

Here's Kristin.

[gentle music] So I'm Kristin Neff, and I research self-compassion.

The research shows very powerfully that the more we can show up for ourselves when we're hurting in a kind and supportive way, the better is our mental health and our relationship with others.

Unfortunately, it's not totally natural.

So we know that our nervous systems are wired so that if we feel threatened in some way, we immediately go into fight, flight, or freeze mode.

But when we're the problem, [laughs] what happens is we fight ourselves.

We kind of beat ourselves up, thinking somehow that will keep us safe, or we flee into a sense of shame and isolation as we perceive other people judging us, or we freeze and we ruminate and get stuck.

Like, like how does self-compassion help people avoid burnout? And, and any advice you would have for me at the top of the show.

Yeah.

Well, well, as you know, self-compassion means we're, we're kind and supportive to ourselves.

We ask ourselves, you know, what do I need to be well in this moment? And what happens with burnout often is we, we lose sight of that question, you know.

We're, we're just focusing on helping others or getting things done or, um, doing our jobs or whatever it is, but often we don't stop to ask ourself, what do I really need? So in your case, we talked a little bit before the show, you, very excited about all these different projects, which is wonderful, but sometimes we overcommit, right? We, we don't say, "Do I really need to do this now?" You know, "Is it too much for me?" Because what happens once we start getting overwhelmed, if we don't, you know, draw appropriate boundaries or pace ourselves, we start getting overwhelmed.

And then what can happen if, if we don't have self-compassion, is we start blaming ourselves because we think we should be able to hack it, and we aren't hacking it.

Yeah

... and all that, right? It's all a quest for self-esteem.

What does the research say on what kids struggle with more? Is it a low self-esteem, or is it a low self-c- compassion, or not having the, or being ill-equipped to show themselves self-compassion?

Unfortunately, it's not totally natural for human beings to be self-compassionate.

It's actually more natural to be compassionate to others.

That's because when we fail or mistake, or make a mistake, we feel threatened, so we try to force ourselves to do better by harsh self-criticism, thinking somehow that'll keep us safe.

Whereas it does feel natural to help others who are suffering because that...

it, it kind of comes from two evolutionary systems.

Uh, the good news is, is we can actually hack the system.

How do we heal ourselves in a way that helps model these kinds of practices to our kids?

When you're ready, here's Kristin.

[gentle music] Hello.

So this meditation is designed to make it a little bit easier for you to access loving kindness for yourself.

So please close your eyes if you feel comfortable doing so, or cast your eyes downward.

And turn your attention inward, starting by just noticing your body right here and right now.

Feeling your feet on the floor, and feeling the weight of your body on the chair.

Let your breathing be relaxed but normal.

[laughs]

I mean, that's just, that's just kind of the way the system is stacked against us.

We all have to feel above average, at least in those areas that are important to us, to feel like that's just, like, baseline minimum self-esteem, and so we're always comparing ourselves to others.

If someone else does something better than we do, we often feel inadequate in comparison.

The other really big problem with self-esteem is that it tends to be contingent.

In other words, we only have self-esteem when we succeed, and we lose it when we fail....So, you know, when things are going well for us, sure, we like ourselves, we feel we have value, but what happens when we fail, or we blow that big job assignment, or we get rejected? As soon as we fail, our self-esteem deserts us, which is actually precisely when we need that self-confidence the most.

Self-compassion, it's not about judging yourself positively.

And will you tell us a little bit about what inspired you to initially get into this field of self-compassion and all of the research that you're doing in and around it?

It's a, it's-- When w- when we directly experience it, we realize that there is a, uh, that, that, uh, the word love in my experience could be interchangeable with the word awareness, just depending on the circumstance and the moment I'm in regarding which w- which word I would reach for.

Uh, and for, for me, it's, it's almost like a, a two-part process.

At first, it's very useful to realize I am not the same.

I'm not identical or identified with the thoughts or emotions or sensations I'm having.

And so sometimes when you m- make that separation, it just feels a little bit more like awareness.

I'm not what's happening.

I am aware of what's happening, and that's useful.

... and how can you help people make that connection?