How do you think police officers are thinking about these differently? I

mean, like, as you said, when I first started my post at the East Church of New South Wales in 2003, the first thing I did was assess the organisation, assess the workforce, look at the ethnicity, look at the religion, looking at all the data to see where our police officers are from and what is their religious or spiritual or pastoral mood.

I have many, many conversations and I did this survey as well.

What is it that they expect of chaplaincy? And 90% of those people have said that they don't want religious support, they don't want spiritual support, but they want pastoral support.

So if we look at the data, the makeup of our police officers and police staff in West Midlands Police, just over 40% of our workforce have actually proclaimed no faith.

The second highest is Christianity and then the third highest is Islam.

So the ones who have proclaimed no faith they often said that they have felt really reluctant to get involved with chaplaincy just because there's a huge misconception that chaplaincy is only a faith-specific service, whereas I'm actually trying to move away from that and show that it's inclusive to everyone, including those of no faith.

male Christian type person.