But could it be somebody that you can plug in, especially in the Bruce Brown's case where he has played small ball five, you know, to switch up in terms of their approach? It's interesting.

I mean, that's what I mean.

Like, I just I look at the Knicks now and.

Obviously, I don't want to diminish the importance of Mitchell Robinson.

Obviously, the rebounding, the defensive position against Wemby at the end of games in the finals, he was a critical player.

But at the same time, I just don't think it necessarily means you're worse without him.

and i just think there's so many different ways that they're now mike brown who has proven he is not afraid to do different things whether it's in the middle of a first round series down to one saying i'm gonna put the ball in the cat's hands whether it's in the nba finals sticking with Jalen Brunson and Jose Alvarado, a small backcourt that he never really used at all.

Yeah,

And I think he's getting that now, and I think that is just as big a part of this as does he actually win it, where does it put him in the, you know, all-time rankings, all of that kind of stuff.

stuff.I do think this is a, a cherry on the top stage of LeBron's career.

But, like, the fact is that if he does win it, and never mind the back-to-back scenario that Charles Barkley is teasing with that high bar, i-i- if the ...

It might not be his intentions to go to Philadelphia, to your point, Rachel.

He might just wanna compete and be in it and have an opportunity.

But the byproduct of that, if he does win it, is bolstering that argument even further that he is indeed the GOAT.

But ultimately, I think, you know, to your point, Danny, earlier, you mentioned, like, you're a Jordan guy.

But KOC, if they're planning for a post-Steph world, should Steph try to finish his career outside of Golden State?

I'm just very curious for your take and, and, you know, obviously Lakers fans here on the West Coast will have some schadenfreude, um, thoughts about this, but what... how can you summarize the whole Jaylen Brown thing?

I'll summarize it as very clearly the public did not value Jaylen Brown the same way that teams did because for the Boston Celtics it's not just what happened this summer, it's what happened, uh, eight years ago.

[chuckles] They, they made an offer for the Spurs for, for Kawhi Leonard b- to... with Jaylen Brown.

They instead opted for DeMar DeRozan, a more veteran player.

They tried trading Jaylen Brown a couple years ago for Kevin Durant.

That didn't work out.

They tried trading him last summer for Giannis.

Uh, should I temper my expectations?

No.

He's on the screen, you see Mobley and Jarrett Allen as well, not enough spacing.

I- it's a, it's a poor fit there.

And not that, not necessarily that trading Harden or having Harden come off the bench would fix everything, but I don't think that that's a great fit on paper.

I don't think that's a championship team personally.

There's something...

I mean, Kenny Atkinson, their head coach, you remember last year after the Pacers series, Kenny Atkinson was talking about how the Pacers had so much more heart and grit and played with force.

[laughs]

No.

He's on the screen, you see Mobley and Jarrett Allen as well, not enough spacing.

It- it's a, it's a poor fit there.

And not that, not necessarily that trading Harden or having Harden come off the bench would fix everything, but I don't think that that's a great fit on paper.

I don't think that's a championship team personally.

There's something...

I mean, Kenny Atkinson, their head coach, you remember last year after the Pacers series, Kenny Atkinson was talking about how the Pacers had so much more heart and grit and played with force.

[laughs]

He did.

So that, that, that speaks to the ego aspect that we're talking about here, these intangible qualities that we're talking about with Jaylen Brown that are part of the equation.

So, like, you have the analytics people.

Analytics say Jaylen Brown is overrated compared to the eye test with the raw numbers, right? But you also have the people who do use the eye test, the people test, and say, "Well, this guy [laughs] isn't as great as he thinks he is," and there's no putting him back into the Robin role to Jayson Tatum's Batman.

And so Boston may have felt that way.

Other teams may have felt that way.

Like, "We can't win with this guy as our best player if that's what he perceives himself to be." Philadelphia, they might not even feel that way, but they're just taking the risk, the gamble on a guy who just finished sixth in MVP voting.

Do you look at Philadelphia as being a title contender with Jaylen Brown?

Uh, Kevin, let me ask you just in terms of where things are at, let's start with Jaylen Brown, where things are at with Jaylen Brown and the Celtics, and, uh, what is markets looking like and, and where the Celtics are at in pursuing a trade.

Well, we know from following the Celtics here in Boston that the Celtics don't leak.

Things come out of nowhere.

And what we do know, other teams leak, and that's my sense of what's happening now.

Teams like Portland, who may have interest, may not have interest in Jaylen Brown leaking that they're done.

All these front offices talking about how, "Well, actually, the guy who finished sixth in MVP voting, and a- actually the guy who won finals MVP, actually the guy who's gotten better every single seas- season of his career, actually that guy's actually not that good." I think it's all just teams trying to drive down the price from what is seemingly quite high on the Boston side of things.

I mean, think about it from the Celtics perspective.

So given that, and, uh, the asking price, where it is right now, I guess, KOC, what are the chances you think that Jaylen Brown is on the Celtics roster for opening night next season?

It was.

They looked incredible.

It was.

And so we saw a flash of what it could look like.

However, I also think if you're LeBron James, a lot of that was watching Luka Dončić dribble, dribble, dribble, dribble, dribble.

And so if you're LeBron James, you're probably thinking, "Well, I wanna go to a team where I can still get touches, and I can still feel like I'm not just watching Luka dominate and be the guy." And Golden State sharing the ball, motion, movement, cutting.

Nobody's just dominating the ball.

No

Are they championship contenders in your mind?

I think they're fringe championship contenders if this actually happens.

I mean, it's hard to bet on a team with a bunch of late 30-year-old guys or early 40s in the case of LeBron.

I mean, how many games have those guys actually played together, right? I mean, is the over-under set at 22, 25? Yeah.

I take the under regardless I think with that team if they got into the playoffs if they got in and they're healthy entering April you'd give that team a shot with that high IQ that skill LeBron still a top 25 guy dream on a still a top defender Steph still a top player and 80 when healthy still a top 15 to 20 player as well so it's a really good roster on paper but getting there and as difficult as the western conference is and how much better it's going to be next year some of these teams at the bottom are going to be more competitive and so that's the tough part it's getting there getting there healthy and that's the big question but it would definitely be fun i hope it happens when i first heard about it over the weekend i was like oh my god like this this needs to happen this would be amazing for the nba be so fun to watch these guys play together so we'd at least get fun i don't know how good they'd be what happens to bronnie james Good question.

That's a great question.

What does happen to Bronny? The Lakers, from what I understand, legitimately like him as a prospect.

What team would you like to see make a play for him? I mean,

Do you now expect this to happen?

Well, so over the weekend there were rumblings that Draymond was gonna opt out after last week when it was all about he's likely to opt in, and I didn't put that in the story 'cause I didn't have it strong enough, and then it happened today.

Uh, I do think actions speak loudly here, and that there are a lot of signals that something big could be going down.

And I, I think with LeBron and the Lakers, no offer's been made yet.

I know it's been widely reported.

I've heard that as well.

Maybe that this is just all about leverage and, you know, later in the week we hear LeBron signed an extension with the Lakers, and AD has signed an extension with the Wizards, and that this was all about the money, and it's all it was about for their own existing teams.

Like, forget another move, just should you be optimistic about acquiring two-time All-Star Ja Morant? I have serious doubts at this point.

Was there anyone that was picked below him in the first round last night that you would have said, hey, that probably would have made more sense for the Sixers?

I mean, in all of my mocks, pretty much, for 22 with Philadelphia, I tended to have a big there.

Henry Vissar from North Carolina is still on the board right now.

I would have liked there for Philadelphia.

Terrace Reed would have been intriguing.

Kristen Ack, who ended up going 27th to Boston.

I was just thinking a big for the Celtics.

I was going

Like, what's the vision there? How do they work together? And is this a move that you think could help them take the step forward against what they've been running up against?

Yeah, T-Bob, you said, like, what's the vision? I think for Minnesota, look at what happened in their playoff serious loss against San Antonio.

They were so, so reliant on getting to the basket that when you face that Spurs defense, Victor Wemenyama, they're packing the paint.

They're forcing the Wolves into becoming a shooting team.

It all fell apart.

And so this is, I think, a flip on how they're going to be viewing how to build this roster around Anthony Edwards.

With LaMelo Ball and Anthony Edwards, you have two of the prime creators on the perimeter of the entire NBA.

What's going on with the Celtics right now?

Was there anyone that was picked below him in the first round last night that you would have said, hey, that probably would have made more sense for the Sixers?

I mean, in all of my mocks, pretty much, for a 22 with Philadelphia, I tended to have a big there.

Henry Vissar from North Carolina is still on the board right now.

I would have liked there for Philadelphia.

Terrace Reed would have been intriguing.

Kristen Ack, who ended up going 27th to Boston.

I was just thinking a big for the Celtics.

KOC, what'd you think of the Giannis

wherever you get your

podcasts.

I mean, in all of my mocks, pretty much, for 22 with Philadelphia, I tended to have a big there.

Henry Vissar from North Carolina, still on the board right now.

I would have liked there for Philadelphia.

Terrace Reed would have been intriguing.

Kristen Ack, who ended up going 27th to Boston.

KOC, what'd you think of the Giannis trade?

What do you make of, uh, that information?

You know, it reminds me so much of the year Paolo Banchero went number one out of Duke to the Orlando Magic.

And, and on the morning of the draft, it was still a question, is it gonna be Banchero, is it gonna be Chet Holmgren, is it gonna be Jabari Smith? And it turned out to be Banchero.

There was so much uncertainty around what Orlando was gonna do, and I think that's very much the same thing this year with the Washington Wizards, where they're really not showing their hand.

I do think, at least from the current intel, is that it is between AJ D'Bansa or Darren Peterson, and Cam Boozer seems to not be as part of that conversation quite as much.

We'll see if that changes, but I do think it is real that there is no consensus within that front office.

Maybe their final decision-maker already knows who he's gonna pick, but they're definitely not revealing that, uh, outside of that small circle.

Uh, what's your best, uh, comp for who AJ could become?

KOC.

I also have Acuff at five in my final big board update coming out.

And to add on to everything Sam said about Acuff just being an absolute killer and an unbelievable three-level scorer, I think with him so mu- so much of the time the conversation is about, oh, what he does with the ball in his hands.

But the fact is, is he did play with another first-round pick in Malik Thomas, and we did get to see Acuff operate off ball too.

He hit nearly fifty percent of his catch and shoot threes coming off of screens and movement actions.

He's shown a real willingness to be a high-level passer, not just a guy who score first, score second, pass third.

He's a very good creator, uh, last year for Arkansas.

So i- if you are in some way a little bit higher, can you please make the positive pitch for Allen Graves?

But Isaac, anyone there at 40 that y- that, like, will there be a big man that you feel like raw, investable in? I mean, the Amari Williams type from, from last year that the Celtics might target?

target?I don't see a lot of bigs- Hmm ... honestly at the board at 40 that are honestly a real difference-maker.

I think what, that point, you're kind of talking yourself into, hey, does Trevion Brazil, a, a guy out of Arkansas with elite athletic measurables, but some injury histories in the backend, are we trying to add him to our mix? 'Cause again, he's more of like a four, maybe even a three-four.

Um, but huge length, great wingspan, elite athlete.

Uh, could give you some secondary rim protection, and is obviously gonna be a menace in transition.

But at 40, there's not a big man market there that I think is a true difference-maker.

I think, at that point, you're probably drafting best available, and it'd be a shooting, adding more shooting to this roster is obviously gonna be a huge, uh, point of emphasis.

They'll figure everything else out, but, like, can you, can you have the motivation and wanna get better? KOC, who do you like in that, in that early twenties?

So what do NBA franchises and front offices make of the whole Peterson vibe?

I think there's a lot of major questions about him still.

The people I talk to around the league, I know there's been some reporting around Utah being comfortable.

I don't think that's necessarily true.

I think with Darren Peterson, there's a lot of questions about the cramping still.

The creatine isn't a full explanation if there's something underlying.

the teams have concern about, and plenty of people I've talked to around the league that do think there is something underlying.

I wanna talk about Boozer, because I remember being at the Final Four and one of our colleagues I was having a beer with, Matthew Winnick, and i asked him just kind of you know making conversation who who would you take of these guys number one and he was like oh boozer and it was like no hesitation instant whatever and and matt comes at the game um from i would say he's you know watches a ton and ton ton ton ton of basketball but also comes at it from an analytics perspective right and that has been it felt like kind of a theme over the past few weeks of like, you know, I have this vision of analytics guys running around their front office trying to show, you know, printouts to their executive just being like boozer like look at this guy's numbers boozer uh so is that the conversation with him and and you know is there just like do nba teams basically think like yeah this guy had an incredibly productive year he's been a winner everywhere he goes he's kind of a sure thing but you know you're getting like a 10-year starter maybe not necessarily a future all-star and is it kind of the analytics guys trying to push him a little bit further up the draft because you just moved him to number two i think in your most in your most recent mock

For sure

... to be great success.

I, I just think with Giannis Antetokounmpo, the upside of it is the fact we're talking about a guy who is one of the most dominant interior finishers in the history of basketball, up there with the Shaquille O'Neals, the Wilt Chamberlains.

Regardless of era, Giannis is one of those players, and if you plug him into a Joe Mazzulla system with so much spacing around him, it is very possible you see the best version of Giannis Antetokounmpo.

And so you add play-making and creation from him.

You add versatility.

Can they use him in the post more often? As well, adding more layers to the half-court offense as well.

Hire the right pro today.

So you've mentioned this, but do you predict that? Do you think Brad Stevens, when it's all said and done next season, this is a new look roster in a major way?

I would be floored if the Celtics enter next season with a roster that looks identical to what we just saw this past year.

I think there will be changes.

I think this is Brad Stevens seeing the ceiling that this team has reached and knowing that, hey, there's a lot of guys getting paid good money on this roster and some good depth behind them on cheap rookie scale contracts that are worth taking advantage of.

But also, I do think this could have something to do with Bill Chisholm, new Celtics owner as well, wanting to put his stamp on the organization as well and empowering Stevens to go out and be original and get creative and try to improve this team's chances of winning a title.

Because look, I mean, the window's open.

We've had eight straight different NBA champions with no repeaters, and none of those eight teams have won that second title either.

First, why did you have Boozer at two ahead of Peterson? And second, what's Peterson thinking, especially given how his college year went? Why would he only talk to one team?

It's time for me to go.

I don't know if Jalen's done that, but, I mean, obviously him calling this is his favorite season.

I don't care how much he hops on his Twitch stream and says, oh, it was because of the way the players developed and people thought we missed the playoffs and we ended up the two seed.

I don't care how much he says that.

It's because he got to be the guy.

He got to be the man.

Everybody knows it.

How does the pairing fit on the floor?

You know, I'm sure you were too as well, as well, KOC.

I mean, look, uh, this is situational basketball.

In a moment like this, I felt like he rushed it.

He should have dribbled it out.

And I, I, I don't understand what he said after the game when Fox said, "I thought I could outrun him.

I thought I could outrun him." You couldn't feel him.

It looks like he kind of took a little peek over his right shoulder.

It's two different mindsets and two different freedoms, you know, as you're playing the game.

We've been talking to everybody about it here, and the common theme seems to be, and, like, my feel with each passing day here, is that this Giannis to Boston thing that we feel, feels like we've been talking about for a month now, uh, seems less and less likely by the day, and the momentum towards Miami seems to be building.

The momentum towards Miami is certainly building.

It seems like, like with the KD trade in recent years, we saw they waited until after the finals to make it happen.

I'd imagine with a Giannis trade, it would wait until after the finals.

So maybe that's what the Heat and the Bucks are waiting for.

However, though, Bobby, I do think the fact that this is so out there, and everybody around the league is talking about Giannis to Miami, Giannis to Miami.

Wouldn't that at least open the door for Milwaukee to be using Miami as leverage for other deals, other sleeper teams, quiet teams, that might be making better offers? And, I don't know, you could make up an argument for literally any team in the league that should be making an offer for Giannis.

Uh, but at 60, close to $70 million toward the back half of this contract, what can Boston reasonably get for him?

[whooshing] What is the chances that Derrick White gets back to being, you know, pre-25, 26 level shooting Derrick White?

That's a, that's a good question.

Um, I mean, I, I, I'd split right in the middle, uh, like 50/50 with him.

I just think White has been so open in the past about the mental aspect of basketball with him.

Going from San Antonio to Boston, he talked about how he's got the green light and all that.

I think there's something to that with the mental side of the game.

And maybe falling into his ideal role next season would help regardless of, you know, if Tatum and Brown are there or not.

Everything's either gonna be okay-

Right

... to have diminished, uh, uh, efficiency on the offensive end of the floor.

We're seeing it this round with Brunson shooting about 20% worse when Wemby is on the floor.

And I think for Brunson, that might just be the reality of the series when you're facing Victor Wembanyama and Stephon Castle on that Spurs defense.

What I'm also worried about additionally is the fact that the Spurs seem to be increasingly targeting him when Brunson's on defense.

Right.

Can they figure out how to get him going against Devin Vassell and Stephon Castle being right in his face, right? Playing low against him.

Can they get Jalen Brunson actually going when SGA couldn't, when Brunson hasn't been able to against Wemby and Castle? Those are the questions that ultimately are gonna decide the winner or loser of the game.