How could they foster perhaps institutional empathy and in a sort of top-down way, but also is there a way for it to have to be bottom-up? How can you make both of those things happen at once?

So when I do this, Jacob, I want you to answer this question.

You should nominate me for the Nobel Peace Prize.

Because I probably have more questions than I have answers, right? Democracies require disagreement, but disagreement today is increasingly existential.

People no longer say, I think you're wrong.

Now it's become, you're a threat, you're evil, you're destroying us, you're destroying our country, you're destroying our democracy.

When politics become organized around existential fear, compromise feels more like betrayal.

Looking back on that, what do you make of the way that Trump has handled legacies such as that and actually actively disregarded them? And what lessons do you think maybe we could be looking at seeing as Trump doesn't really want to look at them?