Karen.

You know, I had never experienced mediumship was just not even on my radar.

It wasn't something I considered.

I never used one in an investigation.

It wasn't even part of our considerations when we were doing our investigations, our cases.

You know, the closest thing that I came was Key West going down to, you know, the big festival at the end of the street and having my palm read or in Memphis when I was in the military going downtown in Memphis and going into some psychic shop and just, you know, you've got a buzz and you go in and you go in to see what they say.

So it really wasn't anything I took seriously at all.

Yeah,

And it was Karen, even though her husband, Bill, talking to the cops, described the scene as if he'd been the one to see her.

He's the one that talked to the sheriffs, mostly.

I was being quiet, and he was a news reporter, uh, for 35 years, so he took control of the discussion, and maybe they just assumed.

'Cause my son said the same thing, "No, Dad saw her." And I go, "No, it was me.

I'm the one that saw her." She was sitting on the top step here, uh, in the back.

And it was unusual, because nobody really comes on the property, even though we don't have any fences in the back of it.

But I just, I, I looked down and I said, "Are you all right?" And she said, "I'm just resting." And I said, "Okay." And then I, I left, went to get my husband, and by the time I got to the other bathroom window, she was gone.

Yeah.

to take her to the woodshed.

Having text messages rather than a vocal call.

I mean, come on.

This is law enforcement and forensics 101.

A text message can be sent by anybody who has access to that phone.

If it's not passcode enforced, If you have a thumbprint that actually you have access to because you put your thumbprint on that phone when it was unlocked at some point, it's not that difficult anymore.

So if it's only text messages, we don't know who sent them.

Does that make sense? It can be done.

Why do they want Jesse Smollett's phone? Listen, when

you're dealing with an alleged victim or alleged perpetrators, the best way now in the world of social media and texting is to get the phone of the victim.

You can look at text messages and Instagram and Facebook and Twitter and all those things, and text messages especially.

Listen, if nothing happened and I understand, you know, the privacy thing and there's phone numbers and emails and whatever that I don't want released.

But the police are not they're not going to go into that.

That's not their interest.

Their interest is looking at communications.