So what kinds of things do people tend to avoid, in your experience, when you're working with your leaders?

Anything that's hard to be with, uncomfortable feeling.

We, I think we know enough now that emotional intelligence is important and it's the buzzword, but I don't know that we really know how to be with our feelings.

We don't have cultures that really teach us that it's okay to feel, how to be with them.

We, I've developed a kind of this in, out, up, down aspect of emotional facility.

Let me speak about that for a minute, and I think explains it.

That in is where we're able to feel things, and we know that we're feeling something, and we know what we're feeling.

So how do you end up doing your work today, Dr Judith, and what are the connections with your past and your childhood? What bridges all of that?

I'd love to start, as always, with how'd you get to where you are today? What's your story?

I wish I could tell you it was a nice straight line, but of course that's not, that story happens.

I think I'm going to go way back.

And I'm thinking about it's really, my story kind of starts as a young girl in a way, because I grew up in a factory town, a union town.

I grew up in Flint, Michigan, which, and as I looked around most of 80% of the people, when I grew up, worked at the factory, many of them, the assembly line.

So they had great benefits, good pay.

But I said, wait, is that it? Is that life? Is that, you know, what's possible? Because that's mostly what I saw.

It's... anticipatory more than satisfactory so it keeps you moving to the next thing make sure you remember how to find that food whatever it is so it's always next promotion next award next accomplishment and it's well in psychology it's called hedonic adaptation you're reaching that goal and then it quickly becomes the new normal and So how do you, Dr. Wright, propose that we actually experience fulfillment instead of that false grasp

Can you take us back to that season of your life?

Yeah.

I, you know, I, I think I always wanted more in life.

I was really trying to find out, out what that was.

I mean, I grew up in a factory town.

I grew up in Flint, Michigan, and it was-- Um, and most of the people I knew worked at the factory in the assembly line, and great, they had good pay and benefits, but I mean, wait, is that it? Is that, is that it? I didn't-- I said, "It has to be something more." And I-- so it was this hunger that I think I had inside of me.

Uh, but I didn't have a good formula.

Mm

So what are the seven?

You know, the first two sound kind of simple and sound like something maybe your grandmother told you or whatever, but we found they're extremely powerful.

And these first two I'm going to share...

My husband, Bob, fought me on them for like two years.

He thought they were stupid.

We have good fights.

We always come up with creative solutions out of it.

sometimes it's like i don't want to look at my shadows i don't want to look and often i know michelle would say the relationships where you go to grow it's not where you go for necessarily joy or happiness and i'd love you to share a little bit about the relationship mirror you know what do relationship reveal about the parts of ourselves we most need to grow

Right

... missing.

You know, m- it's just like, is this just all there is? In fact, [laughs] that was the title of my first book, There Must Be More Than This.

And I think sometimes that's the feeling that comes up, too, because there's success, but s- doesn't feel like the meaning is fully there or the purpose is there or the, the relationships in their life aren't where they want them.

So we, we look at the whole life being really successful in their business and their leadership, but also having high quality of life so everything's working.

And that's what we've studied.

Our- my research, research project was really studying people who live great lives, people who have a great relationship with themselves.

It's about purpose, meaning, and so the, his next phase for him was sharing what he had learned in sales, and he and I have also just finished a book on culture and the unique nature of his culture that performed better than any other culture in the e-commerce space in the world.