Jon Symes
Jon Symes is the creator of Narrative Leadership, a speaker and mentor helping leaders and midlife men rewrite the unconscious stories shaping their lives, and author of the upcoming book "The Stories That Are Killing Us" and founder of Whole & Free.
3
APPEARANCES
3
PODCASTS
Oct 5, 2026
Jon SymesGUEST
As men, it's important that we're, uh, independent and strong, so we are unlikely to ask for directions when we're lost.
Jon SymesGUEST
[chuckles] Um, uh, as men, it's important that we are the provider for those that, uh, are around us.[lips smack] Those, those are some of the, some of the, uh, most obvious stories.
12 MINS LATER
Agi KeramidasHOST
And I will leave it to you for your parting words and, or any last message to the, the listener or the viewer of this conversation.
Jon SymesGUEST
Typically, that's a collection of stories that we, um, have had some hand in the design of.
Jon SymesGUEST
But there's also in there this huge mix of the unconscious stories that we can't even see.
Jon SymesGUEST
Uh, and so we get then in those first adult years to walk inside the stories that, that are that combination, and it takes some time usually for us to see the efficacy or the utility of those stories.
36 MINS LATER
SanaHOST
I mean, what does it actually mean to be inside a story that you cannot see? Is it about something like a template that has been handed over to us or is it some kind of a different reality? I mean, what do you mean by this, John?
Jon SymesGUEST
Well, an analogy that often works is to think about story as the operating system.
Jon SymesGUEST
And just as your computer has an operating system which you don't see and you only interact with it very briefly, it's really you're more interested in the programs you're running or the sites that you're able to visit because of that operating system.
Jon SymesGUEST
And story is a little like the operating system inside every level of human organization.
13 MINS LATER
SanaHOST
Yeah,