Even though you're Johnny Marr, you're still entering their space, aren't you?

Yeah, no, exactly.

You know, that's one, I guess it's... there's so many things that, you know, so working with other singers, say with Chrissie and then with Bernard Sumner and Matt Johnson, which was all at the same time, by the way.

You know, I was in The Throne Electronic at the same time.

I was in two bands and I was still, I was working with Chrissie and I think, I look back and I go, well, my ability to work with those singers isn't just about me playing the guitar.

It's probably to do with my personality as well.

Yeah.

You know.

We began by discussing how he worked on the songs for the album.

Well, the making of it was, was a little unusual in that me and the band took the step of playing the songs live before we'd actually recorded them, which i- is a bigger deal than it sounds really, particularly as they weren't entirely finished, written by yours truly.

[laughs] Yeah.

But I did that for a reason because, um, it would be a good idea to play the songs live in front of an audience.

And then we went out on tour in America and around Europe, and I started putting these songs, as I was finishing them, into the set because there's nothing quite like standing in front of a couple of thousand people to iron out some wrinkles, you know? It's kind of a bit of a throwback really, because in the modern era, people are so concerned with songs being leaked on YouTube and people hearing-

Tell us what the song says as a statement.

Um, I get lost down every road, spend all day looking for a sign, wait all week for something to find, and it takes so long just to take my time.

I think it's about the dilemma of being presented with so many options on any given morning, probably coming through your phone.

Did you just know when you met her, Johnny?

Yeah, I mean, it...

Yeah.

I- if...

When I actually say i- what happened, it, it, it does...

It really does sound like I'm overeggling it a little bit, but it literally was.

When a, a teenage party, didn't know I was gonna be there, turned up at this place.

Yeah.

Mm.

So yeah.

I've, I...

It's, you know, kind of...

And I'm not en- entirely typical because I got involved with making some records that I've... people really love over time.

Um, uh, and...

But I, I didn't actually write the words of.

Mm.

I mean, I am aware

that it's amazing.

I've been doing it 40-odd years now professionally, man and boy, literally.

So I see the start of my, not about career, but anyway, my professional life at 15.

I left school at 15 to join a band with adults.

They were a band called Sister Ray and they were grownups and they had a record out and they asked me to be in the band.

you would assume that that would be quite an odd pairing, and it was.

Can you remember, was there somebody you saw that look and you thought, that's what I like, but I'm going to put my own little spin on that? When did that happen?

Is it just being in a band? Is it that feeling of being in a gang that you really, you really enjoy? What is it that draws you to that sort of collaborative thing? Because I mean, yeah, you collaborate so, so much with so many various artists.

The right gang, and it's, uh...

There's a certain idealism about it.

So at 15, 16, like a lot of people, maybe people are listening, listening to this, um, being in bands at 15, 16.

Now, I...

That was just a no-brainer for me because I always wanted to be the, uh, the life of a, a, a rock guitar player.

I just, I wanted that to be my entire life, so you are in a band.

And, uh, yeah, man, it's been a, just an absolute pleasure hanging out with you and discussing all of this stuff and digging in.

Because the music of the time, there was a lot of rock, a lot of heavy guitar

sounds.

Well, I do think it's a thing with young people all across, certainly the arts, that you want something for your own generation, for you and your mates.

And you do react against the culture that came before you.

As a person, I wasn't a particularly angry kid or anything like that, but I was definitely opinionated and on one appropriately and obsessed with guitars and songwriting, obviously.

Very opinionated, as were my friends, about what had come before.

And frankly, guitar culture, as much as I adored and obsessed over every aspect of it, It started in the late 70s.

If you could change the world, the musical world, if you like, or the wider world in any way, how would you change it?

Right.

Be- because previously, or Detroit, 10, 15 years earlier, the city center was where you would buy secondhand records, secondhand guitar, secondhand clothes, or just cool shit.

But America and its capitalism, same as ours, but they are always, back then anyway, 15, 20 years ahead of us.

What I saw, and then when I lived, when I was in Modest Mouse, I, I lived in Portland, Oregon.

I then learned that, oh, if I wanna go and get a...

If I needed a gui- a guitar shop, or if I wanna go and get some decent shades or a good hat or whatever, I've gotta get in a car, and I've gotta drive into the suburbs or sort of what would be now the equivalent of, like, Walthamstow or, like, you know, or, um, you know, s- Brixton or something like that.

I ain't gonna get it in the West End.

I was at Primavera though.

You did? You signed it for me? Thank

you.

Yeah, so I did some events with that, which was brilliant, beautiful.

So by the time that was done, I'd had a new kind of...

And the book took a couple of years to do.

I'd spent a lot of time with these guitars.

I'd sort of renewed my relationship with these guitars, which, by the way, have given me 45 years of loyal service already.

War Child.

Is it something about you, like you yourself as a person, or about your playing or a bit of both that allows you to fit in with so many different kinds of people?

Well, I guess so, but I, I think musicians are very, uh, welcoming and inclusive types of people.

It might be a bit cheesy, but I, I have a certain kind of pride in that, not my personal kind of about myself, but my, you know, brothers and sisters of music, you know.

They-- Because let's put it this way.

I've been around...

I don't know whether you've ever been in a room with several actors or in a taxi with several comedians, but often there's a bit of a competitive vibe with...

I know it's a generalization, right? I've, I know a bunch of great actors, and I know a bunch of some great comedians, right? But I, I've noticed that musicians are very...

Yeah