What led you to start that course? And I've heard you say you're a theology professor who now teaches politics.

My story starts around the same time as Stephanie.

I was working on my dissertation, and in it, I was examining the intellectual virtue of open-mindedness, considering whether or not it was a virtue from the Christian standpoint, and asking myself in the dissertation what the value of intellectual diversity was, and again, how Christians might think of it.

Upon finishing that degree, I took a job at Duke University in their Institute for Ethics.

I looked around and noticed that our country was highly polarized.

The campus was reacting to Trump's election.

And then in having coffee with students outside of class, I discovered that many of them were self-censoring, not saying what they really thought about controversial political topics in discussions with friends.

You do have courage.

Just because the legislating isn't literally happening in Washington doesn't mean there isn't things going on behind the scenes, and I'm wondering if you could clue us into that, please.

Sure.

That's exactly right.

I, you know, I think some of the terminology that gets applied, like the August recess or recess periods, uh, are really not accurate.

As a member of Congress, I can tell you, uh, you're, if you're doing your job correctly, you're always on because, you know, you're always subject to being called by your constituents, and the issues don't quit happening just because you're back in the district.

And in fact, you're exactly right when you say this is the time when members have the opportunity, if they take it.

And now I think it's fair to note that some members are probably, uh, more diligent than others in terms of staying in touch with their constituents, but that's what these times are for.

Do you have ethical questions beyond what you just mentioned? Because it seems to me that it absolutely raises an interesting ethical conversation.

How does a well-known cartoonist pick his successor? The process might be more subjective than you'd expect.

I have picked up the phone, and the voice on the other end said, "John, this is Fred Lasswell." I kinda, like, choke on my Cocoa Puffs.

But word for word, he said, "I got the packet of samples, and I really like the way you draw big noses."

How did you become Snuffy Smith's cartoonist?

I was working as an editorial cartoonist and was a member, I still am a member, of the National Cartoonist Society, and we have an annual meeting.

And at this meeting, I was talking with a fellow editorial cartoonist, and he told me that he was working as an assistant on a syndicated comic strip, and I didn't really know that comic strip cartoonists used assistants.

Ever since I was a child, I've, I've always wanted to be a comic strip cartoonist, and I thought maybe this was a way I could enter the world of comic strip cartooning.

So I, I thought about it, and the first comic strip really that I thought of was Snuffy Smith.

How do you balance that? If you were governor, how do you balance that between, you know, protecting the state of Tennessee from, as you said when you were here with me, uh, from some of these woke companies, and creating an economy in Tennessee that does provide jobs for the people of the state?

Sure, I, and I think that's a very fair and relevant question.

I think it really comes down to Tennessee driving a harder bargain.

You know, we've got 500 people coming to Tennessee every day, and I think I sense in your question, and lots of job opportunities, uh, you know, some people would say Tennessee's been doing very well on that front.

And so, you know, when you, when you're in the, when you're in the catbird seat, so to speak, and I think Tennessee in so many ways is, people wanna come to Tennessee.

They like what they see in Tennessee.

And so we're in a position where we can drive a harder bargain.

So if you were governor, would you see that as a good idea for our state?

Are you confident the Republicans can stay in control?

I believe Republicans will stay in control because I think we have the best policies that, uh, meet the wishes and needs of the American people.

You know, the other party is fighting a civil war with the, uh, most extreme liberal elements of their party, uh, you know, even calling themselves at this play- at this point socialists openly and trying to pull their party toward the liberal extremes of their party in, in ways that I think are just out of step with where Americans are.

You know, uh, President Trump was reelected on the promise to get our border under control and keep it under control.

We see voices from the other side who want to espouse defunding the police, de- defunding ICE, defunding law enforcement, opening our borders, things that I think the American people resoundingly rejected.

And I think, uh, the American people should not take comfort that that will continue if these, uh, most extreme elements of the other party are allowed to take control.

And so I think Republicans continue to offer the best solutions.

If you, John Rose, become the next governor of Tennessee, why would you be Donald Trump's favorite governor?

When it gets down to budget time, when it gets down to budget priority time, the relationship between the governor and the speaker of the house may be the most important relationship in terms of moving things forward.

I think that's exactly right.

And I, you know, as a governor, I learned this from my sister, who was a lobbyist for Farm Bureau for most of her career, that of just how important it is to stay in close touch with not only the speaker and leadership, but with the rank and file members in the legislature.

You know, one of the questions I get as I travel across Tennessee, and we've done now 87 town halls across Tennessee, and people ask me, you know, how are you going to take care of the rural counties and maybe some of the forgotten areas or places where people feel like they're forgotten.

And, you know, I say two things.

One is, as a governor, I'm going to be present in those places.

We're going to make it very intentional.

Follow and listen on your favorite platform.

When it gets down to budget time, when it gets down to budget priority time, the relationship between the governor and the speaker of the house may be the most important relationship in terms of moving things forward.

I think that's exactly right.

And I, you know, as a governor, I learned this from my sister, who was a lobbyist for Farm Bureau for most of her career, that of just how important it is to stay in close touch with not only the speaker and leadership, but with the rank and file members in the legislature.

You know, one of the questions I get as I travel across Tennessee, and we've done now 87 town halls across Tennessee, and people ask me, you know, how are you going to take care of the rural counties and maybe some of the forgotten areas or places where people feel like they're forgotten and and you know i say two things one is as a governor i'm going to be present in those places we're going to make it very intentional and not say other governors haven't but we're going to make a real concerted effort to continue to be present in these places across tennessee that that have felt forgotten in the past but secondly You know, one of the ways that you can stay in touch with those folks is to develop relationships with the elected representatives that they send to Nashville and have regular conversations with them because they're very keenly and highly motivated to, you know, stay in touch with what the local electorate in their areas want.

And so if you're if you're talking to them, you're going to be getting at least a sense for what the population in those areas want.

And, you know, obviously that's useful for helping them to build consensus around what the priorities should be and gain support for the priorities that you set.

Why? And what is the statement you're making and what is the reaction been to that?

Well, I'll start with the last part of that.

Yeah.

Um, and, and, you know, I had just run in the small area of, that I represent in Congress, 6th District, 19 counties.

It's a big enough area, but beyond that, there wasn't a lot of reason that people would know who I am.

And, and so we've closed that gap now, and, uh, and interestingly, uh, you know, we're- we've closed the polls.

So, uh, the polls we did, that we've done ourselves right before, uh, the start of early voting had it as a s- a sta- a statistical tie.

Get my tongue twisted there.

Uh, and then we just heard another poll yesterday that, uh, continues to vet out that fact that, uh, we've closed the, the gap, and the energy's on our side.

in it, right?

Now, first off, you are presently a congressman from up around the Lancaster area.

How's that been? Well, you know, it's been interesting.

I'd stop short of saying enjoyable because Washington is a kind of toxic place, but it's been a great honor and privilege to represent the people of Tennessee and feel honored that the people of the 6th District have given me that opportunity for the last seven and a half years.

Going to finish strong January 3rd.

This coming year will finished my fourth term eight years in Congress.

But I think I've got some leadership left and that's why I'm running for governor.

And you've been a proven conservative as congressman for Tennessee.

At least here at Murray County, you seem to have momentum.

Don't you think you could have won some people over?

Perhaps so.

And our polling data tells us, incidentally, that, you know, I'm the second choice of the vast majority of Tennesseans who may have chosen for one reason or another to support one of the other candidates.

But I think at the end of the day, if you're going to have a debate, you need to have all of the voices at the table and Tennesseans.

And so if we did that, then clearly we'd be letting her off the hook.

And so I think the focus here should be on Senator Blackburn, who's the one who said she couldn't come.

You know, I'm saying it again right now, you know, ready to roll up my sleeves.

So where are you at today? And Is the China farmland stuff overblown? What's a bigger threat to Tennessee? Is it the illegal alien invasion that we have to deal with, or is it the Chinese?

Am I recounting it based on what you know about how this whole thing started?

Well, so in part, I think you've got the pretty complete picture.

Though I will tell you, I had been talking about the possibility of running since earlier in 2024.

And quietly, Chelsea and I had been contemplating it before that.

And I will tell you, I was given assurances that Senator Blackburn, for example, was not interested in running.

I mean, actual assurances that that was not the case.

And never the indication that Senator Hagerty was really seriously contemplating it.

domain? How does that work?

Congressman, what's your response to your Republican colleague on the other side of the Capitol?

Well, Phil, thanks for having me on the lead tonight.

My response to him is that he's the one that's out of touch with Americans.

Over 83% of Americans support the Save America Act.

Senator Tillis, I think, is headed on his way out the door, and it's a good thing because he's out of step with Republicans.

He's out of step with Democrats.

Over 70% of Democrats across the country support support the Save America Act.

Why do you think Tennessee voters should see those documents?

Congressman, what more can you tell us about this?

Well, certainly I understand those who want to see us begin to move in the direction of further constraining the growth of spending.

But we also have these important priorities.

Obviously, I would tell you the Save America Act is the number one, should be the number one objective of this Congress to get passed.

If we can't safeguard our elections, all will be lost.

And so I fully support the Save America Act.

We passed it three times through the House.

I want to

John Rose, Congressman John Rose on the Starbucks deal, this is what he had to say.

Yeah, I think it's a bad idea, and for a number of reasons.

First of all, we're spending $30 million to bring a company here that's very successful.

It's not clear the payoff is what it should be in terms of the upside for us.

But we have to keep in mind who this company is, and again, visiting with Tennesseans across the state, what I continually hear is that, you know, we're, they're concerned about the future of our state and whether we're safeguarding our, our, you know, Tennessee values.

And, and so we could not recruit a more woke company to Tennessee.

I mean, if you, if you study what Starbucks has meant and done historically, uh, you know, based in Seattle, Washington, one of the most woke cities in the country, we certainly don't want the environment in Seattle, in Nashville, Tennessee, or in our state.

Mm-hmm

How do you feel about that? What do you think about that? And are you thinking strategically about how you would grab that bear? Because it's coming.

Absolutely, and you look at those reports, and the TASA report is very sobering if you look at it, and I don't doubt that that's probably, if anything, maybe a modest appraisal of what Tennessee needs to do.

And I think for too long we have kind of celebrated the success that we've had as a state in terms of the growth we've been seeing, and we've reaped a lot of benefits from that.

But now we see that that growth is outstripping our capacity to keep up with the infrastructure demands that are needed.

And so we see then future growth coming really at a trade-off of affordability for our state and, you know, ability to maintain the quality of life that Tennesseans treasure and that the people coming here treasure as well.

And so I think, you know, and I'm reticent to say this because I know it will be something that will shock a lot of people and evoke maybe negative feelings, but we just can't have unmitigated growth in Tennessee as we go forward.

You know, I observe this with the people I talk to and then get their reactions, but we're adding 500 people a day.

Will there be a debate or debates?

How do you feel about that? What do you think about that? And are you thinking strategically about how you would grab that bear? Because it's coming.

Absolutely.

And, you know, you look at those reports and, you know, the TASA report is very sobering if you look at it.

And I don't doubt that that's probably, if anything, maybe a modest appraisal of what Tennessee needs to do.

And I think for too long we have kind of celebrated the success that we've had as a state in terms of the growth we've been seeing.

And, you know, we've reaped a lot of benefits from that.

But now we see that that growth is outstripping our capacity to keep up with the infrastructure demands that are needed.

Will there be a debate or debates?

But what if she doesn't? Would you debate Representative Fritz?

Well, I don't think that would be productive.

I think Tennesseans know who the main candidates in this race is.

Certainly our polling substantiates that Representative Fritz, and I don't mean any offense to him, is not going to be one of the contenders for the Republican nomination for governor in Tennessee.

He's just not well enough known, and that's unfortunate for him and his supporters.

So I think if there could be a debate that would include the three of us, I would be happy to participate in that.

I think it doesn't make good sense to have the listeners get a chance to hear from two candidates.

As governor, how do you fix what's broken in Memphis?

Is that fair to say?

Yeah, that's, that's very fair to say.

And, you know, the other thing that I learned with when I joined New Heat was, how do you, how do you end up getting the, the buy-in of the staff and get them to want to come to work every day and work really hard? And I realized that, uh, that it was all about l- l- you know, being interested in them and what they, that what their personal lives were all about.

And I remember, uh, in, um, it was Canada Day, and my sister was over, and we were celebrating.

She-- and she said, "You know, you've got a lot of different company-- countries represented in your staff.

How do you help them celebrate, you know, their National Day?" And I said, "Oh, wow, Wendy, I, yeah, I, I don't know.

I'm gonna look into it." So when I looked into it, there were twenty-four countries represented.

But, uh, I mean, what was it like for you having gone through that? It sounds awesome.

Is that make or break for whether or not Tennesseans would elect a governor, whether or not they perceive proximity to the president?

Well, I think what Tennesseans feel is they're very supportive.

And our polling shows that they're still very supportive of the president.

They support his agenda, his policies, his plan for restoring the country.

And they want candidates who are supportive of the president.

And so, you know, I have been unfailingly supportive of the president.

The reporting that you talked about, I was there.

Their senior engineers are merely reviewing what the AI has already created.

Is that make or break for whether or not Tennesseans would elect a governor, whether or not they perceive proximity to the president?

Well, I think what Tennesseans feel is they're very supportive.

And our polling shows that they're still very supportive of the president.

They support his agenda, his policies, his plan for restoring the country.

And they want candidates who are supportive of the president.

And so, you know, I have been unfailingly supportive of the president.

The reporting that you talked about, I was there.

their senior engineers are merely reviewing what the AI has already created.

So you believe this deal in particular was not the best deal?

Yeah, I think it's a bad idea, and for a number of reasons.

First of all, we're spending $30 million to bring a company here that's very successful.

It's not clear the payoff is what it should be in terms of the upside for us, but we have to keep in mind who this company is.

And again, visiting with Tennesseans across the state, what I continually hear is that they're concerned about the future of our state and whether we're safeguarding our Tennessee values.

And so we could not recruit a more woke company to Tennessee.

I mean, if you study what Starbucks has meant and done historically, you know, based in Seattle, Washington, one of the most woke cities in the country, we certainly don't want the environment in Seattle, in Nashville, Tennessee, or in our state.

Uh, nuclear energy and, and Tennessee, uh, are you satisfied with where we are currently with that? And do you want to see us become even more aggressive?

What's your view?

Well, I think it's premature, with all due respect to Congressman Stutzman, who I have the greatest respect for.

But I think we can't ignore the fact that Israel is our, you know, most important ally in the Middle East, steadfast ally, and we need them to be successful in the region.

Obviously, the Abraham Accords that the president led in his first term in office demonstrate that there can be peace among reasonable people in the Middle East, but we need a strong Israel.

I think it's premature.

Our support for them is critical to not only their security, but to the security of democracy as a foothold that they provide there in the Middle East.

So I think there may be a time when Israel can be self-sufficient and not need the magnitude of aid that we've been giving them in the past, but I don't think that time has arrived yet.

Congressman, is this concerning to you? And as we kind of pontificated earlier, what does this signal? Or does it signal anything? Is there legitimate war fatigue? Are tides turning? Or do you sense still that there's a solid base in the Republican Party with the president with respect to Iran?

There doesn't seem to be any big public affront from President Trump on Thune.

Well, I first would say I think Mike Johnson in the House, we're getting the job done.

Unfortunately, the Senate is sitting on its hands and John Thune is not delivering for the president on the promises that the president made and that the House has delivered over to the Senate.

So I think the president does need to call Leader Thune to task.

I think the United States senators need to call John Thune to task.

We need to pass the Save America Act.

It's the number one way to get this country back on track, and it's shameful that Leader Thune has been stonewalling and failing to deliver on that promise that over 80 percent of Americans, over 70 percent of Democrats want to see delivered.

Is that on Thune?

Where is the funding for the Department of Homeland Security, Border Patrol, ICE, and the rest of this?

Well, thank you for asking that question.

And it is another area of frustration.

And I think, again, underscores the dysfunction that we see happening in the Senate because of the adherence to the filibuster rule.

But as we talk right now, what has happened is late last week the House yet again voted, and this time we passed the Senate funding bill that funds all of DHS with the exception of Customs and Border Protection and ICE.

and actually defunds them.

And I'm a little bit embarrassed to say that that's what's happened.

How is the how is the campaign trail going and what are people talking about in the state of Tennessee?

Look, what I don't understand here is what's the holdup when you say you want a warrant before you go search an American citizen's private data? I mean, that's like a fundamental tenant of what our country was built on, and yet we have pushback from Republicans on this.

Well, so I don't understand that, to be completely honest with you.

I mean, obviously those folks in the intelligence community are telling us that it would be too big of a lift for them to actually follow the law, the Fourth Amendment, and give Americans the Fourth Amendment protections that they deserve.

I understand that we want to catch terrorists and we want to use the tools that we have to do that.

But frankly, that doesn't excuse or somehow suspend the Fourth Amendment.

And we've You know, and so there's a price we pay for our constitutional rights.

I understand that.

Can you give us really briefly, if you can, an overview of how important it is to push back on this?