So a different question, what advice would you give people coming up to retirement in terms of planning or thinking about retirement? What advice would you give?

I would say, if you can, prepare as early as possible.

And I don't mean that in the sense of study slog.

And in fact, the reason for starting to think about it early is so it actually can be playful and without pressure.

I think if you leave it to a month or two before your retirement date or after you've retired.

You're then liable to put yourself under pressure to feel, I've got to, I've got to come up with something, you know, I've possibly got this void coming.

And so I need to find things.

What next,