What has that experience of practicing law, teaching law, and other things, but taught you about the human condition and how your faith has interacted with that understanding? I'm wondering about

that.

Yeah.

So as a Christian, one of the things I try to remind myself is that every human being I encounter is an image bearer, an image bearer of God.

And that suggests to me that everybody has a set of fears, hopes, joys, gifts, and insecurities, and probably has something to teach me as another image bearer so that I try, in my best days, I try to see other human beings as these unbelievable opportunities to engage with part of God's creation.

But the insecurities piece of it is also really important.

So I remember, in my experience, lawyers and doctors are particularly bad about forgetting just the humanity of the person across from them, because we're trained to be experts in a certain set of skills.

What's a good way to think differently from that?

Yes

... that emerges over time.

It doesn't make it not significant or unimportant, and the stakes of our politics have enormous consequences for real human lives around us.

And w- and when, you know, for, for most of us, we have issues and candidates and ideas, uh, that we care about because we care about human flourishing and helping people and living a better, more just and truer society.

And when those issues and candidates don't win, then it's perfectly fine to name and, and work against the injustices and the evils that you see in the world, and try to change those through the political process.

And, and so it doesn't mean that you sit by complacently and just say, "You know, we're all just gonna sit around and not worry about this." I think what it means is when you reach points of no compromise or when there are winners and losers through elections or laws or anything else, that you go back and work hard through the political process, through the law, and through other means to try to persuade your fellow citizens that you've got the better argument or the better policy or view of the world.

And sometimes that takes a very long time.

Yeah.