What do you tell to people when the objective is to shut down a refinery or a plant? who think that it's not just impact, it'll just impact that point, but it's not coming back.

Right.

There's a misconception out there that we can just flip a switch and put a refinery back on and have it up and running immediately if the need presents itself.

And it's really unfortunate that this seems to be a prevalent thinking.

I do believe in California policymakers are starting to see that with these refineries, the two refineries that we lost recently, there is a true impact to the marketplace now.

And everyone needs to really stop and take a breath and assess the situation.

We are seeing it.

When we talk about jobs and the fact that from a labor standpoint, is there a danger in adopting job energy policies without first making sure that there are comparable jobs waiting for the workers who could be displaced?

What do you tell to people when the objective is to shut down a refinery or a plant? who think that it's not just impact, it'll just impact that point, but it's not coming back.

Right.

There's a misconception out there that we can just flip a switch and put a refinery back on and have it up and running immediately if the need presents itself.

And it's really unfortunate that this seems to be a prevalent thinking.

I do believe in California policymakers are starting to see that with these refineries, the two refineries that we lost recently, there is a true impact to the marketplace now.

And everyone needs to really stop and take a breath and assess the situation.

We are seeing it.

When we talk about jobs and the fact that from a labor standpoint, is there a danger in adopting job energy policies without first making sure that there are comparable jobs waiting for the workers who could be displaced?