... that it is actually about like an instinct that we have that we don't know that we are more than biological.

Mm-hmm.

I think even beyond an instinct that we haven't uncovered, I think there are some other ways to think about this moment where we are and where we're headed, and I think a lot of us are talking about them, but they are just not adopted by the people in power.

And what I mean by that is there's still too much emphasis on how many of us are there, and there's still far too little emphasis on, you know, what the quality of life actually is or who matters.

I mean, you think about places where there's still tremendously high infant mortality rates.

You know, almost 5 million people die every year, children die before their fifth birthday.

Like, that is not a world that we would consider to be at all a, a thriving world.

Mm

So is there a country that is doing it right? Is there a country that has normal, healthy growth that is sort of the model?

No.

Uh, everybody is...

They, you know, it, there, that doesn't exist.

And I think the point where we are right now is that there are so many policymakers who are asking the same question you're asking, and they're chasing something that doesn't exist.

Like, can we get to this point where it's like, um, you know, you think about water flowing into a pipe, and it's, it's totally steady, and so, you know, you don't have any kind of, uh, backups in the system or anything like that.

That doesn't exist.

Mm-hmm