Perhaps, first of all, we could tell listeners about what the problem is and why we're discussing it today.

Birds are migratory species, and they travel through cities along these different flyway routes, you know, sometimes going all the way from, like, the tip of South America all the way to North America, and there's other flyways in Europe as well.

So when they encounter-- They fly by night.

When they encounter places to rest, they need to rest overnight.

They oftentimes land in cities that are on waterways, and then the problem is they come down, and they are attracted to habitat along the streets, and they end up crashing into window glass and buildings in extraordinary numbers.

I mean, like, one billion birds die every year just in North America with these collisions.

So it's really having a big negative impact on bird populations, which as you probably know, have declined precipitously.

But what have you managed to do in the architecture that you've brought to Chicago and other cities that you think has begun to address some of the problems here?

Can you explain what that means and how the concept manifests itself in architecture in your work?

Well, that came about...

I, I was trying to communicate why, I guess, why we do architecture, and oftentimes you receive a brief and it has the parameters of what you're supposed to design.

But I found that, like, sometimes there, there's a lot more opportunity to what the impact a project can have than just what's in that brief.

So this comes from the idea that we are idealistic.

We want, you know, to make the world a better place and to improve the condition, but we also have to be realistic, and actionable means that step by step we can get there, but we need to think about the long view and, and work intentionally toward each day toward making that a reality, to make the cities we want to have, to make the world we want to live in.

And, and so that's what it means for us.

And I think the comedy of people around our country, we don't have these public spaces as much as we used to.