When you left school, was psychology your go-to aim goal?

No, absolutely not.

When I was in school, kind of didn't really know what I wanted to do, which is probably a story that resonates with a lot of your audience.

But I was good at science and maths, and growing up in, in regional WA, it was basically like, "You're good at science and maths, do engineering, and work for one of the mining companies," and that's the well-trodden pathway that everyone goes on.

And so I went to uni, started doing engineering, got like a year and a half into it and realized I didn't particularly like it too much.

And then the way that University of Western Australia, where I went, is set up is you have to do broadening units.

So I kind of was keeping an eye open for what other things were out there.

How are you working with AI from, from your role point of view?