How are you thinking about attribution with regards to who helped create that?

I think the game has evolved quite a bit.

I'm a very big data nerd.

My last business, we had 292 Tableau dashboards.

I could see every metric under the sun when I woke up and I would look at most of them.

But I do think the game has evolved where maybe it used to be 80 or 90% data and 10% art.

I think it's 40% art these days, right? It's a lot more complicated.

How do you think about measuring each of those channels? Or do you think about TikTok lifts all the boats and you just care about the sales outcome? But do you measure by channel? How do you think about just measurement in general?

When you pick the types of creators that you want to work with, do you go for big followings or people who are just naturally a great storyteller? Like what's your criteria?

Yeah, I mean, I think for us, we try to find creators where our partnership would be authentic.

So like if they're already partnered with maybe an ingestible beauty brand or a hydration brand, might not be the right fit because the audience is gonna be like, hey, you like this brand and now you like this other brand.

And that's not always very authentic.

So we want people who are like, hey, this feels like it'll fit in their routine and they would be a brand champion and it's a good connection.

I think my advice for brands is like, you wanna work with creators who are similar size as you.

So if you're a new brand up and coming, you might wanna work with new creators and sort of build together.

When you look for a live host, how do you make sure that they represent your brand well?

So how are you thinking about how are you integrating creators kind of into the broader, almost like retail strategy?

Yeah, I mean, I think.

Right now, we haven't quite finalized it, but we want to create the greatest influencer program that anyone could be a part of.

So we want you to be like, if you're a creator, you probably have a TikTok account.

You probably also have an Instagram account.

We want you to be able to post on either about the product.

We want it to be natural.

It's like, why did they launch K2O with Kylie Jenner? Like, how can brands learn from that? How can brands learn from this expansion?

But right now, I mean, after probably listening to this or even listening to the guys, Hudson at Comfort and the rock stars at TikTok Shoppe, um people are like i gotta get you know this rolling i gotta send out samples i gotta do this i gotta do that and and kind of build a creator army um but it's not easy right and and i'm sure you know that firsthand but um would love some examples for for the audience of you know any any common mistakes uh that you see brands are making or even something that you probably you know you felt you could have done better um would love a little tidbit from from your end

sure i think uh I think a couple of things.

Like one is, you know, I always say, you know, you got to – I tell a lot of people like stick with what you know, right? So like if you're a business and you're growing and you have huge success with Meta as your primary marketing lever, every day you should wake up thinking about how can we do more with Meta? Is it more content? Is it more hands on the, you know, wheel? It's a bunch of stuff.

But I think – it shouldn't be like, hey, we should go jump into TikTok shops tomorrow.

Most of the time I don't recommend is that, is like the best next strategy.

Plenty of people, and I think, you know, I've done this many times, but like shiny object syndrome is the fastest way to waste money every single time, you know, just because everybody else is doing it doesn't mean it's going to be great for your brand.

Every brand is a little bit different.

Can we get a peek behind the curtain? Like how many creators are you actually working with? And like, how are you structuring the program?

How often are you speaking to, say, everyone within that team? Are there times where you're not speaking to anyone? You're just speaking to the directors and the VPs and people on that line of seniority? How did that actually look?

A couple different things.

I'm big on a weekly leadership meeting with all those direct reports.

So usually I have one call, usually on a Monday, set the priorities for the week.

And yeah, I would say most of my time on the weekly was spent with those directors or VP levels that reported into me.

And then I would try to get them to build rapport with their direct reports.

Probably most of my VPs and directors find me a little annoying.

Do you, what is your opinion on kind of looking for consultants or fractional, you know, support? Is that something that's a no and you're looking for that dedication to bring them right in house, build that culture up? Or do you see a world in which you are kind of, you know, doing bits and pieces fractionally or with agencies, you know, outside of the world that you're building?