Walk us through the last six to 12 months of the Hyperliquid Policy Center and your transition into being the

CEO.

It's been a long road.

It's funny that you go all the way back to the ICO days.

I feel like we've been doing this work for so long.

To me, Hyperliquid really is the next generation, the next phase of of what we in this industry are trying to build.

And so I have committed my career really to trying to figure out how we navigate the bleeding edge of law and technology.

Can you just help us get to the fact of the matter here? What is the path to bring perps onshore to the U.S.? How would you see this playing out?

But, you know, I'm curious to hear your thoughts on whether or not crypto perps are like a fundamentally different product from these real world asset perps or if you think they can be covered by the same rules.

Well, I guess I'll start.

I don't think there's anything unique about the underlying asset of any derivative that should change how the derivative is regulated.

And I think it is absolutely true that one reason we're talking about perpetuals now is because they have proven to be an extremely useful tool for hedgers and speculators outside of the crypto markets.

Granted, perpetuals were in some ways an innovation of crypto because they became popular because of crypto exchanges offering them for the first time.

But perpetuals are in so many ways just a better derivative for many use cases.

They don't have fragmented liquidity across many expiration dates, so they have much deeper liquidity.

And I know, like I said, it's a big question, but even in broad strokes, if each of you want to take a stab at that.

Where, where are things at with rulemaking when it comes to perps?

In progress, and I, I, I think we have to divide this into two different categories.

The first being perps that trade on already registered traditional centralized exchanges, and then separately perps that trade in DeFi protocols or through on-chain financial infrastructure like Hyperliquid.

And on the centralized perp side, I think that the CFTC is very constructive on providing guidance so that it's clear when and how a DCM can list a perp and allow it to trade in a retail-facing environment.

We've heard Chairman Selig speak at a couple of different public events where he's explained that he understands the benefits of perps and that they should be tradable on a DCM.

He describes them as perpetual futures in that context.

And so I think it's likely and, and certainly something that would be beneficial for the market and for the country for the CFTC to come out with some guidance based on what Chairman Selig has said publicly.

Because those-- I mean, that to me is a really important question that we're gonna need to sort out.