So you've got the real world experience behind you of what can actually happen when you do take those risks.

Absolutely.

And when you've got a young family and you've also got a massive team that you're working with, you don't have the luxury to fuck it up.

You just don't.

And I don't know, just along the way, I think I became exhausted at from that pressure.

What eventually happened was, firstly, before I had my children, my brother-in-law, a lot of this was around leadership, obviously, and where I've seen the journey actually starting to really evolve from a business perspective.

Yes, I learned a little bit about business and what have you in terms of this company.

and