Yeah.

What things do we need to get rid of? Because really we wanna be lean, so it's not like, what else do I need to develop? But what things we also we gotta get rid of.

So those leaders that are able to be to, to be true, to be able to be committed, and really live by those values and consistently align to the values, are the ones that, um, not only are sustainable, but they're enjoying their lives.

[laughs] So I have seen that with- in my coaching.

A lot of times has been, uh, it's exactly actually that's what, um, the whole concept for me, and, and I lived that, was with my heart disease.

Because the surgery that saved my life is called a heart ablation.

And what is a heart ablation? Well, like I told you, like, uh, my heart would go really, really fast, and it would go irregular.

Right.

Hmm

... um, the expectations I received.

It didn't make me go any less.

It didn't make me like, "Hey," like, "the, the rest of my life, this is all I'm gonna do." On the contrary, because I acknowledge and I received and I was open to that love, it made me...

Honestly, I surpassed what was expected of me.

I graduated from college.

I didn't just graduate from college, which was one of the things that they said, again, heart's not beating, oxygen's not coming, brain's not getting oxygen.

And now, how can leaders recognize the difference between people who are resistant to change and people who simply don't understand or trust where the organization's going?

But between your birth and when you got cleared by the hospital to move forward, is there anything else we missed, Hannah, or anything else you want to add? Do you think this is significant for the listeners either going through or their child's going through it?

Actually, yes, a couple of things.

One is, like I mentioned to you, I did have that second heart attack that there's a huge miracle that I was in the morgue and came back.

Right.

I was brought back.

There was a lot of things that I had.

I didn't have oxygen.

How do you, for our listeners, some of them never considered whose thought is it, but for you, how do you describe how to listen? Is it a thought that Saint's trying to play in your head or is it a thought God's encouraging you with, or is it your own unique thought? Yeah.

Yeah.

But what I can tell you is that at the time, I didn't understand a lot.

I mean, it didn't make sense.

What didn't make sense were the times I did run and my heart would go fast and it was a natural thing.

And I realized that happens with other people.

When you run, your heart goes fast and it's a good thing.

It's so that your heart, it can pump blood and it gives the energy to everything else.

Explain that in a way that leaders can understand it and they can take action on it.

So now, so now can leaders even tell the difference between a people problem and a system problem?

That is such a good question.

Okay, so here's the deal.

You have a couple of things, right? I mean, we, we, we're very good at, and it depends, you, you have the industries because, I mean, we can talk about different industries.

You have very compliant industries, compliance driven, where there's a, a lot of different external certification processes and things that need to happen in order to keep safety in place, right? Like you have certifications for safety, you have certifications for being able to do things.

So you have industries that by nature have got to be very compliant, yet that compliance doesn't take away the fact that you're still working for and with humans.

So that is one of the parts, is understanding, first of all, the industry, the nature of the work.

Mm

Mm-hmm.

And how you do you transfer ownership? Well, you can't transfer gut.

You can't just transfer, "Hey, this is like my..." [laughs] Transfer just the passion like this.

There has to be a pathway for people to be able to, um, not only get, be invited and enter the conversation and enter the work, but also to be able to continue and evolve the work, and that's where processes and systems comes in.

Um, that's where we're transferring it beyond not only the visionary, not only the, the team that really may have even been initially impacted, but that's where us leaders, we get to invite and talk about the impact, uh, the impact and the sustainability question come in.

And processes and systems allow for that.

It allows for the multiplication, for the sustainability to where it goes beyond just what I physically have the strength to do.

Yeah.

Why so many organizations still struggle with empathy at the top? Wow.

Oh, you want to get into that? Okay, why do they struggle? Again, one is, well, we people call it a soft skill, but really is love, right? I mean, the big part is love, but also the purpose.

We in many times in businesses, you know, and I understand, you know, people say money talks.

So where do they go? They follow the money.

But in following the money a little bit and a little bit and a little bit, they end up over here to where their mission was over here.

And the empathy comes in and the empathy and realizing like, hey, this mission, this vision is worth pursuing.

And we're being empathetic to the people that both were receiving our services and the ones that yet are to receive our services.

What's the biggest misconception about leadership development that you see in corporate training today?

Do you find that a lot of organizations that you're with are struggling with that? And are you seeing maybe a rise of burnout or disengagement because of not handling those signals?

Yeah, no.

And I don't know how much of the rise is.

I do know that there's greater awareness of it.

because it's getting to a point where it's honestly, it's not sustainable, right? I mean, it never was, but now we're actually talking about it.

We're seeing the aftermath of, of this practices.

And even, and that was one of my wake up calls, even with Six Sigma, right? This is methodology where we're getting to effectiveness and, you know, decreasing the downtime, decreasing the loss of productivity, making productive, effective teams.

Are there any frameworks for all my systems thinkers out there, frameworks that you have that you want to share with this group?

Do people now are more even stressed because of that?

Well, sure.

Because, I mean, think about it.

It's like you already have...

When things are good or, you know, hey, we got money to pay the bills.

Think about it like at home.

You can tolerate certain level of discomfort.

you need to you need to be aware i need