Even with your skills.

I didn't build this business.

Again, this was like 2002.

There was no idea of like, there was no term of entrepreneur and founder and exit and getting rich.

Like that wasn't the playbook.

The playbook wasn't written.

Right.

What did the five years of not being able to talk openly about this teach you about resilience and grit? I'm sure there was some very dark days where you wish you could have been telling people what was happening behind the scenes.

How did you come up with the idea for The Fill?

It was circumstantial.

So Unilever implodes, self-destructs, pulls everything off the market, doesn't sell anything for nine months.

Nine months, not a single product was sold, not even a laundry bag, not even your ironing board cover.

And I knew, I had a hunch what they were going to do.

I waited to see what they did, and they did exactly what I expected them to do, which was relaunch the brand with the Seventh Generation formula with my label on it, with some nod version to my fragrance.

Because they, like, banned...

What happened?

store.

It was a real brick and mortar store.

The way that the laundress was structured from day one was we sold direct to consumer, which wasn't a term in 2004.

I mean, Amazon was still selling books.

Things weren't shipping and selling and clicking and certainly not 32 ounce liquid bottles.

Right.

So that was completely unheard of.

Yeah, so I'm