I mean, um, why do you think the MQL, why is the MQL so hard to let go of, and what, what does holding onto it actually cost?

Um, it's interesting, right? If you think, kind of go back to when, um, MQLs were coming, the, the absolute rage, the founding kind of attraction of that isn't necessarily wrong in terms of a notion of, well, can we segment how we're marketing based on demographic, demographic fit and behavioral fit is a sensible thing to do compared to the available alternative.

So rather than kind of spraying and praying with kind of all-up marketing segments to everybody, being able to track that through into micro segments is a sensible thing to do.

I think the problem is taking that and then taking it to its absolute kind of zenith of saying, "We can therefore bring everybody down to this completely kind of linear path that they're moving through, and then ascribe to them a kind of a, a readiness but buying score, and assume those things happen in a vacuum, and kid ourselves that complex buying is kind of led by, by one individual as opposed to, to groups." And so I think we've probably all been then in rooms planning marketing programs since, which take that and overlay into it things which just aren't reflective of the way that real-world buying happens.

We say, "Well, if we can only make people aware enough, and then educate them enough, and then kind of get them into an opportunity to buy, then the, the money will come rolling in." And as I say, the notion of m-multi-threaded buying and a realization that in complex decisions, you have known buyers, you have hidden buyers, you have champions, you have detractors, each of them need to hear different messages, consume information in different ways, share that and champion that in different ways, is something which is constantly moving and morphing, and it would be another fallacy to say, "Yep, you can now create a 3D version of the linear path," right? Instead, it's thinking in a kind of almost like structural systems mindset of-

Um, in practical terms, you know, for a team organized around the lead or, you know, historically this kind of legacy notion of a, of a lead, what's the most practical first step towards measuring and influencing the whole buyer group that they can take, and, and who should actually own that?

So, um- On the point around ownership, clearly it's a team sport, right? My background's in account-based marketing, and p- constantly in ABM workshops trying to say to people, "The enterprise sales lead, this is acting like you naturally do otherwise, but trying to ensure the entire kind of go-to-market effort is reflective of that." So you need a combination of marketing stakeholder, sales stakeholders, data stakeholders to come together and see what that looks like.

A v- very sensible starting point is to look at not boiling the ocean, but instead saying, "Let's look at some in-flight opportunities, or let's look at a particular segment that we're targeting is important to us.