Carter, stonewalled, and so forth.

One of the stories that's been flowed around the UFO community is that the Democrats don't get a proper briefing 'cause they don't have the connection to the military the way the Republicans, the Republicans know more.

So the story's always been that Jimmy Carter didn't get told anything, Bill Clinton didn't get told anything.

But Ford, Reagan, and Bush all knew what was going on.

The final push to create a Space Force came just months after three leaked military videos of unidentified aerial phenomena became widely circulated online.

The Navy goes in and shows Trump three videos, the GOFAST, the GIMBAL, and the TIC TAC video, and basically give him the video.

So what is Trump gonna say? So what is it? And they had to have said, "We don't know, Mr.

President.

Yeah

... was head of covert ops for the US government, for the CIA, and he said he walked around for three months in a daze.

He was just, it blew him away.

Whatever they told him blew him away about this, this, this size stuff.

And then he said, uh, his wife would ask him, "Jimmy, you okay?" And he couldn't tell her what was wrong or whatever, what he had seen or whatever.

And he said he just sort of...

And then they said, "Would you like another briefing?" He said, "Nope, no more briefings.

Wow.

Grant Cameron is the author of Presidents and UFOs.

They said, "We can't allow you to use the film.

You have to do your own version of it.

Something that might have happened in the past may happen in the future." So they did that.

It was a documentary called UFOs: Past, Present, Future, and they also had a book by the same name.

Even without the military's footage, the 1974 release of Emenegger's documentary caused a stir among the UFO community, and many believe the alleged encounter at Holloman Air Force Base influenced a much more famous film.

The documentary was done in 1975.

Steven Spielberg's Close Encounters of the Third Kind came out in 1977.

I'm sorry.

Yeah.

So when Damon Steer asked her, I was not surprised at all that she made this comment.

And it's important in two respects.

Linda, you've already mentioned the one, that for the first time, a high-level official has talked about the fact that they actually may be here.

The whole scientific debate, and this comes into this time and space thing that the Rendlesham guys got experienced, was that the main objection by scientists to the UFO phenomena is the time-space argument.

You can't get here from there because of time and space restraints.

And my question to you was, A, why what is the reason the intelligence agencies are using this i understand that when you sign a document that you can't talk about it you can be you know brought up on charges but they have to be justifying this to the president and the people they're asking and in number two a follow-up after that is why would why have things changed now why just because the american opinion and we're more on social media why would all of a sudden after you explain why the justification you're using Why should we believe that somebody knew that would be elected was going to be able to do anything more than the last person who hasn't been able to?

[laughs]

I had no interest in it whatsoever.

And suddenly what happened was I, as I said, I chased the Canadian government.

The early 1950s, there's a top-secret Canadian government document that I had quoted, Stanton Friedman has quoted, and we've talked about it endlessly.

It's a legitimate top-secret Canadian government document from November of 1950 where the Canadians go to the Americans and they're asking the American officials, "What's the deal with flying saucers?" And they're told, "Flying saucers are for real.

It's the most highly classified subject in the United States.

There's a small group headed by Dr. Vannevar Bush who's, who's trying to figure out what's going on, and that the subject is of tremendous significance to the Americans." When this download, the first piece of the download came to me, it was the very next line in that document, and the very next line in the document said, "And we were also told by American officials that other things might be associated with the flying saucers, such as mental phenomena.

I will.

Mr. Cameron, what would disclosure look like to you? Is it what's taking place now or not really?

Okay, this is where it gets kind of complex because everybody has a different idea of what they think is disclosure.

So if you take a look at Jim Lukatsky was the guy that ran the OSAP program.

That was the big UFO program for the Department of Defense Intelligence Agency.

He wrote four books and he said, I have given you disclosure.

So what he says in his disclosure is, yeah, UFOs are for real.

And he adds the fact that we have a craft.

Restrictions apply.

Grant, one of the areas that I hope that we could start with today on Phenomena Radio is what is your perspective from all the research that you have done going back into presidential archives about what might actually have happened with UFOs at RAF Bantwaters Woodbridge on that December 26th to 28th, 1980?

Well, I discovered this by accident.

Basically, I was aware of the Rendlesham Forest story, but I was lecturing in Eureka Springs, Arkansas about 10 years ago.

And I had gone back to where it all began for me in 1975, where for a whole year, there were a series of sightings of an object known as Charlie Red Star.

And I had gone back to the town to film different spots where I had some very close encounters with these things.

I actually had it.

It was almost like.

But the very fact that that was hanging in the wings and that Hillary Clinton, Bill Clinton and John Podesta knew all of that, Why do you think that Lawrence Rockefeller was not able to leverage this open beginning back in 1993?

And I think that's basically so we can weaponize aspects of this so that we are the dominant ones in space and everything else and that we have basically ultimate control over all this technology, right?

Yeah.

And Jim Semivan, if you've listened to some of the interviews Jim Semivan has done in the last couple of months, he's about the most open guy.

I think he's the best guy to listen to.

And he basically talks about this.

He said the committee that's now been formed and he deals with them.

He interacts with this committee that's been formed.

Now, when writing this, were you surprised at how many people had actually had these experiences of being able to navigate and pilot a UFO?

Tell me about that.

Yeah.

So be- uh, the Managing Magic was, uh, the original first book in, in, second book in the series, and that was, um, when I started to realize that it wasn't, it wasn't just UFOs.

It had, had to do with all sorts of paranormal phenomena.

You'll find, you know, a lot of, uh, experiencers when they, once they've been abducted or had experiences suddenly become psychic.

They got orbs flying around the house.

You know, they can't touch electrical equipment, all this kind of stuff.

Are we getting any closer?