So maybe if we can start just discussing that and how that is different from financial fraud.

Yeah, for sure.

And I think you and I both share this passion for abstraction of fraud attacks and methodologies and training, which... is a good way to always help our teams and the industry in general think about what's the next potential attack and potential threat we should be looking out for.

In ad tech, we define fraud based on any kind of manipulation that...

Out there to monetize and drain the advertising budgets of brands.

The largest brands in the world are our clients today, which means I get the fun and fun.

very, very stressful experience of having to explain fraud attacks to you name it.

Something that surprised you? What were the things where you said, oh, that's actually a very novel angle or perspective to maybe look at fraud or maybe prevent fraud or detect fraud?