How about you, Gabby? What's your role with families and what stage in the process do people typically reach out to you?

Well, I... much like what Claudia said, which was awesome because that makes so much sense.

And I too, I feel like it's super important that families understand that the body knows what to do.

We have gotten involved in everybody's stuff like we do with everything else and start to kind of redirect and change and add and subtract and move.

We have to take control of everything, but at the end of the day, the body knows what to do.

And the family, those who are preparing to say goodbye have to trust that.

And so as putting aside my nursing skills experience, just as a doula, I want to get them at diagnosis.

And so, Gabby, when do people typically engage you? Is it similar, sometimes early, sometimes late?