Why do you think it is only in the last really five years that we've started having these conversations and maybe why do you think we started with menopause?

Conversations are happening on a micro level between women's friendship groups or trusted colleagues or on a very small level but what we find and actually it was my predecessors that did the menopause one so I can't take any credit for that one but really it was one of my previous co-chair who was experiencing menopause herself and was having these discussions no doubt at home and with friends but also with some colleagues and as the conversation started to evolve and we had more focused conversations groups then we realised there's a lot of people that are struggling with hugely debilitating symptoms in their life which obviously includes in the workplace and not enough has been done to talk about it to address that and so I think that that's why menopause happened first you know for us certainly and when we spoke to women around the business and tried to think about what might help them.

We put those symptoms and the needs and tried to feed that into the policy.

So I think that's what started first.

Obviously, Channel 4 has quite a special place as a public service broadcaster, as well as the BBC, obviously.

this country but we can also feed what's happening on a societal level into the content and in fact have a responsibility to under a remit so the menopause policy led into our programming led into the davina mccall documentaries which came out of our news and current affairs department and obviously she went on her own campaign and that launched into a much wider national conversation about it That's how we started in menopause.

And from there we, I can't remember now exactly why pregnancy loss was the next one, but I think menopause was seen as also a women's issue.

If I was somebody on a women's network, another company listening to this, and I wanted to go and convince my board about why they actually needed to be taking some of these issues seriously, what would you tell them?