So can you walk us through what that process and that realization was like for you, and maybe how you speak to leaders now about the importance of this type of stuff?

Yeah.

I think the, you know, it's, it's a little bit like TV channels, that not everybody's gonna be a, a Hallmark Channel fan, and psychology has a super high adoption rate, and things like culture and stuff like that has a super high adoption rate with the Hallmark Channel watchers.

But, uh, the people that wanna watch the History of War all day long and that generally populate these executive roles, uh, they, they're not attracted to the, the idea that people have, uh, mentalities and personalities and things like that.

Um, they kind of really at the core hope that people just show up and do what we hope they will do, and they don't realize, um, maybe I need to or should invest in making sure that they're in that mentality.

So what I, what I kind of realized on my journey was getting down to the hard neuroscience of it was a lot more convincing for these people 'cause it's kind of like, uh, mechanical.

It's, it, it turns into something less woo-ey and less kind of feely and in th- into raw mechanics.

[laughs] Yep.