felt like he could

drink for free on that forever.

But this is a fickle business.

Stalker is the most important, most followed sport in Mexico.

And if you are not continuing to produce or if you do something that flips the fan base on you, you're going to know about it.

Ask Chicharito about that.

Chicharito Hernandez is the all-time leading goal scorer for Mexico, and I think that he has managed to piss off even the most ardent Chivas fan with his comments in the last few weeks, let alone Mexican national team fans.

I think they're probably relieved that at least for now, he's not just posting weird videos from the training center.

Who's your biggest winner out of the bunch?

And clearly it's got to be split between Julian Quinones and Silberto Mora, right? Julian Quinones is a guy that going into this World Cup, a lot of people were not even sure that he would be a starter or a contributor for Javier Aguirre, given that Aguirre had been quite vocal for months saying, like, I'm not sure, I don't like Aguirre.

that these players go to, you know, second-tier, third-tier leagues.

In Quinones' case, he's in Saudi Arabia.

And he ends up being Mexico's top scorer at the World Cup.

He ends up lighting this country and this fandom on fire based off of his appearances and the performances that he puts forth.

He's on the radar for Premier League teams.

What can we expect out of his philosophy? What can we expect out of the Rafa Marquez coaching cycle with Mexico?

Did you think it was boring?

No, I mean, that match in particular in Spain at this World Cup in particular, that's for the ball knowers, right? I mean, I think this World Cup has been fantastic for soccer in the United States.

And for, I mean, again, I live in Mexico and there are a lot of people in Mexico who do not watch soccer on a regular basis.

And so this World Cup has made it so that you've got these players incredible amounts of people who are casual fans or maybe don't even care about soccer, but have been drawn in by the tournament itself, the tournament proper, watching these matches.

And it's pretty easy to fall in love with the sport when you're watching England versus Mexico, Argentina versus England, Argentina versus Cape Verde versus Egypt, you know, However, you get this Spain versus France game, and you've been watching France demolish people all throughout the tournament.

And then suddenly, to the untrained eye, it's like they didn't even show up to play that match, right? It's like, what happened to France? You can really tell who does not have a real analytical grasp of the sport when they're talking about what happened to France.

It's like, I will tell you what happened to France.

It was just a masterclass.

I don't know if this was something that was close enough to you that you took notice of, but certainly by the time we all woke up on match day, we knew exactly what it was that happened outside of the team hotel.

Yeah, I think, you know, ultimately it's a sports thing because we saw Knicks fans, you know, outside of the Spurs team hotel during the NBA finals trying to intimidate them as they went in there.

I was talking to a friend and colleague of mine, Raul Alegre, who is the former kicker for the New York Giants, two-time Super Bowl winner.

He said, you know, it happened in the NFL when I was playing in the 80s, you know.

So this is not strictly a soccer thing, but clearly, A lot of the identity behind what fans can do to impact a match is rooted in soccer and in this tactic.

So the fact that Mexican fans did this, it just made me laugh so hard.

Because if you know Mexico City, the neighborhood in which Ecuador State and...

I mean, for you, right, that's the first time in your life that you've seen Mexico win a knockout game.

Really, like, you know, the full range of emotions there in that third match in Mexico City.

Yeah, I mean...

None of what you just mentioned so succinctly had ever happened, right, for Mexico at a World Cup.

This team had never won all three of their group stage matches.

They had, I believe, not since 1970 gone through a group stage without allowing a goal in the group stage.

And it's just become this massive party and this massive love fest between the Mexican national team and their fans.

Um, that might not seem too strange to say, but if you're not familiar with the mechanics of Mexican software, it is very strange to say this team has a love hate relationship with the media and with fans.

You want to talk about a perfect swan song for a legend, man, like that was handled perfectly last night.

Do you want to take issue with the officiating there on that second goal?

I think we're seeing a lot of home cooking when it comes to the officiating at this tournament.

I mean, I saw, again, fair play Canada.

They absolutely destroyed Qatar, but that first red card was questionable against Qatar.

You see a lot of these 50-50 type calls being favorable to the home team.

I actually think that in Mexico's case, and not to be a homer myself, there was a bit of... disrepute among the officials from that first game, from that game against South Africa that were just too happy with the cards and with the red cards, especially two on South Africa, one on Mexico, that, you know, the crew that was picked for this second group stage match against Korea, they were like, we're just not going to call anything.

And these guys were just kind of wailing on each other for 70 minutes or so.

The goal or the save?

Can you tell us why that was such an emotional moment for fans of Mexican soccer?

Raul Jimenez is a guy that has had just... an incredible story.

He's the guy that came out of a very small town in central Mexico, Tepeji, in the state of Hidalgo.

Multiple times during the course of his career, he said that he was, you know, this close to dropping out of these different academies that he was in, Cruz Azul first and then Club America second, because he felt like he was not good enough.

I mean, Coaches loved him because he's a tall guy.

You know, Mexico doesn't have a lot of 6'2 strikers, 6'3 strikers.

So he definitely always was built for the sport of soccer and for the position that he plays.

Is he Colombian or is he Mexican? But I guess nothing mattered there when he scored the opener of the 2026 World Cup.

What are Obed's chances of making this final roster?

His chances are quite good.

And I think you referred to that earlier by saying Javier Aguirre was only really impressed by Vargas until he made the move to Atletico Madrid.

It makes perfect sense.

This is a team that Javier coached back from 2007.

2006 to 2009.

He's playing for one of the biggest teams in the world.

What percentage chance do you actually give them, give Rafa Marquez of finishing the 2030 World Cup cycle as the manager of the Mexican national team?

Yeah.

Uh, so that kind of leads to this question.

So, um, where are some of those, um, risk areas for the, for organizations that might have already adopted, um, not to put them in fear, not to make someone be like, "Oh, what do we do?" But what are some of those things they should maybe go and take a look at quickly, and then start moving towards documentation of that?

Mm-hmm.

I almost think of it kinda like, um, regardless of how you think of Tiger Woods and everything he's been through, um, when he started going through swing changes back with Hank Haney back in the mid-2000s before he went on his big run, he went from, I, I think it was, they said, a per round of a, uh, an eight under to, like, a nine and a half under.

It was so, like...

But that change made a, a big run for him to start making some big wins in his-

[laughs]

A lot of people, when I say Nokia, say, "Oh, I had the hands...

I, I used to have the, the phone and play Snake on it." Um, and I loved that phone, uh, of course.

But no, I started with Networks early 2000s, built out 2G networks back in the day.

Uh, worked there until we rolled out 5G.

But all along the way, kinda felt the call to, you know, jump into the ministry.

Um, and of course, you know how it always works, is someone starts talking and someone says, "Hey, I think you would be a good fit here," or, "You should talk to this person." And it got me an introduction into, uh, into a nonprofit world.

Like, why am I gonna give again?"

where did it go wrong eric

that's about as clear as day right first and foremost you know like you cut the one guy who's having issues with the coach and then you extend the coach that's crazy it was i mean based off of my reporting and and the people that i've spoken to who are close to san diego fc who cover the team every day folks who have covered the mexican national team and have an idea of who chucky lozano is his entourage which is very important i'll mention why it went south from day one.

And I'll say this because there were certain demands made by, and this is, again, this is off the record.

I don't want this coming back to me with the aggregators.

This is just two or three different people told me different versions of this story.

But, you know, it's pretty much confirmed at this point.

So members of Chucky's Entourage asked the team, San Diego FC, for certain items, certain amenities, and certain guarantees that were supposedly only, you know, to be extended to the player, to be extended to the family, to the entourage, to these people that I'm mentioning.

Where to next, Eric? I mean, I guess the most logical would be Liga Mequis.

That's what you're referring.

That's what I'm referring to, yes.

Other games were bad matchups for Mexico.

2010 is a perfect example that Argentina team was far superior to Mexico, but they also had help from the referees because there was a goal there that should have been called back.

by Carlitos Tevez.

2018, you go up against Brazil.

Brazil is trying to essentially, you know, make their mark with that current generation of players that they had at that time, led by Neymar.

But more importantly, I'm curious if the presence of Messi in MLS Cup, this last MLS Cup 2025, if from a global standpoint, you think that's changed the perception of the league?

Is there really a Messi versus Mexico rivalry? (laughs)

(laughs) It seems to be, right? I mean, at the end of the day, everything's quite fresh.

There had been instances in which Messi had faced off against Mexico, obviously with Argentina before then.

And we hadn't- hadn't really seen that much of a, uh, of a rejection, if- if you will, from Mexican fans towards Messi.

I think it all stems from that particular, uh, gesture.

Now, the irony in all this is that the, the 2022 incident that started this entire thing, Messi, as you said, trades jerseys with Andrés Guardado.

Those two are famously very good friends.

Ah.

That's the vibe that I got, that this wasn't a first-time event with how casual and how comfortable they were in speaking to these people, these individuals. It seemed like they have worked, in their terms, more games before. You mentioned the pay. Well, they're getting $2,500 to $3,000, you know, just for this game, per the report. I don't want to excuse what's going on, but I want to give context. What you said about promotion relegation, I think is very important here. When you put a ceiling, when you cap a player's earning potential, some of these players are of the age where they should already be in first division, where they should already be advancing in their careers, and they can't. And they get themselves into situations where they see that window minimizing, closing, and all they've ever done is play football. All they've ever done is play soccer. They've not studied, they've not gotten into a- a trade or found other resources of income. So they see this window shrinking, and they see no room for advancement. Promotion relegation, I think plays a massive part in this, into how they see a- a way out. It- it's a sad situation, and- and it gets worse. On Monday, February 10th, the club received video calls. The club, uh, Real Apodaca, received video calls, and instead of going to the league or the federation, Eric, they released a statement, uh, where the participants, the players would be immediately separated from the team. Five days later, the federation punishes the players with Real Apodaca and Correcaminos. You as a reporter, why do you think the club released a statement before even going to the league, going to the federation? It- it just seems like there's a disconnect there.

Yeah. Well, first and foremost, I think that they- the- the club itself wanted to get a hold of the situation before they- they actually, uh, notified anybody else or- or kind of attempted to put the lid on things before it got bigger because they wanted to know how deep the rabbit hole went, you know. Ultimately, you're talking about players here, but, you know, if you're the team president, if you're part of the backroom staff, you don't know if the manager, at that point in time, you don't know if the manager is involved or not. You don't know if assistant coaches are involved or not. You don't know if ref- you know, the referees who worked those games are involved or not. So I understand that they- they might tr- be trying to play catch-up themselves with the type of information that is being filtered through. But at the end of the day, you want to know what is expected, uh, in terms of discipline for your team moving forward. So I think that's why they- they, uh, sent out that- that communiqué, uh, basically detailing, "You know what? We've- we've located the players who were involved in that video. Those players have been immediately separated from the team. And, you know, just l- let's buy a little bit of time and figure out what- what else happened here." The second reason, I think, is far more nefarious, and I think it's- it's- it's something that you're hinting at. We don't know who was involved in this, uh, particular match-fixing scandal exactly. And what I mean by that is the individuals who offered the money, we still don't know if they are part of any organized crime, if they are part of a wider, uh, scheme to fix matches in Mexican soccer or Latin American soccer or even world soccer. We don't know who these people are, and there is an element of safety and security in Mexico that a- a lot of people know about i- when it comes to, again, organized crime. So you want to make sure that the people who are involved in this are not necessarily taken care of in- in the sense that they are protected, uh, from retaliation, but you want to know how deep the rabbit hole goes in order to protect the people who are definitely innocent and playing and working for a team like Real Apodaca. As you mentioned, Apodaca is in the state of Nuevo León. Nuevo León, uh, m- uh, capital city is Monterrey. Uh, organized crime is a very, very serious problem in the northeastern, the northwestern, just ba- basically the northern part of Mexico, based on how close it is to the US border. And, um, you don't take those types of things lightly, you want to figure out what happened. Francisco Tede, who is the player that you mentioned for Correcaminos, who, uh, was essentially the- the facilitator for this deal, is a, uh, 26-year-old player, right? He'd been playing in lower division Mexican soccer for the last ten years. He debuted at 16. You mentioned, you know, a lot of these guys, you know, imagine a young Francisco Tede, 16 years old, you're already debuting for a fourth, fifth division team. That has to give you some semblance of promise in the sense that if I'm 16 years old and I'm al- I'm already a professional soccer player, then there's a chance that I might rise up. The farthest he got was the second division with Correcaminos when they were part of the Liga de Expansión. You're 26, you know, ten years later, I think you can rightfully assume that your chances of playing for a Liga MX team, or even playing for a Liga de Expansión team later on, are slim to none, right? So I'm not justifying what this guy did. It is obviously a stain on the game. It is a stain on, uh, his profession and his teammates and the players who were unaware while they were playing this game. But-... to get involved with, uh, folks who might potentially, uh, not guarantee your safety, which is something that Francisco Tevez said later on.

Yeah. And we're not saying that Grupo Pachuca's, by any way, you know, in anything. Grupo Pachuca, uh, the- the ownership group is, uh, one of the better ownership groups. But like, as you said, when you share the same owner, speculation, uh, can be mixed into the equation. I mentioned each club owner has a say, a vote, in what happens in the federation and what happens with the Mexican National Team. Well, it should be the league is one entity and the federation is another entity. And it's not. So what's best for the league isn't necessarily best for the Mexican National Team. What's best for the league is- is better players. And that means, oftentimes, more foreign players. What's best for the Mexican National Team? "Well, we don't export these players so we need less (laughs) foreign players." So, they're at a constant conflict of interest and they've been so for quite some time, but like I said, uh, a discussion for another day. Is there anything else you know of with this investigation? Because as far as I know, it's died down since. The- the- the- the last three, four days, if not five, a week, there's been very little talk. I- it seems to have been swept under the rug and we go back to life as usual. Has there been anything on your end or is this something that's just gonna go with the wind?

You know, there are some very diligent journalists and reporters in this country who are still kinda banging the drum with this. But as I mentioned before, once you start getting into, uh, the territory, or potentially the territory, of organized crime and- and- and, you know, crime syndicates, international or national, that is a very, very tricky situation, especially in a country like Mexico where protections for journalists, regardless of the fact whether they cover sports or anything else, are not very, um... it's not very secure. It's not the best profession to have if you're looking to ensure somebody's safety here, right? So, I think that regardless of the fact, as I mentioned earlier, investigations are still ongoing. Those investigations are pretty much limited to Real Apodaca, to Correcaminos, to the players that we know were involved in this particular betting scheme, and kinda taking a look at the last 12, 18 months of- of matches or so for each team and figuring out if there were any other s- instances in which match-fixing might have occurred. You know, Herc, I think the question here is, if this happened already with Real Apodaca, with Correcaminos, with the players that we've- you and I have mentioned were involved, I don't think there's any good reason to suspect why this would not have happened with, uh, players in other teams in the third division or maybe even in other divisions themselves. You've talked about there being betting scandals in Serie A, uh, MLS, the Premier League. Why wouldn't there be a betting scandal in Liga MX with all of the other, uh, elements that we've discussed? I think that there are several people right now who might be active players, who might be retired, who might not even be in Mexico anymore, who are probably sweating it out a little bit. And I say this with full confidence. I think that this is not a situation in which it is the first time that it has happened in Mexico. I just think it's the first time that somebody got caught in Mexico. And the reason why we're seeing these investigations kinda die down is pretty simple. If you uncover that there is a, you know, even a hint of a betting scandal in Liga MX, that has the potential to really affect the popularity of the league, it has the potential to affect sponsorship deals with the league. It has the potential to affect the international standing of the league itself. I mean, this is a sports competition that has pretty much allied itself with MLS for the last, what, 20, 25 years?... across SuperLiga, Interliga, now Leagues Cup. There was talk of a merger at some point between both of these leagues. I mean, you can't have any of that occur if you are making business with a, uh, with an American sports league such as MLS. So, I think there are very, very clear financial markers, very, very clear financial reasons as to why Liga MX, the Mexican Federation, and everybody involved in the scandal are hoping that it just kind of dies down and goes away. Fr- Francisco Teje, you get 16 years of a, of a suspension here. All these other players got between eight, 12, and, and 16 years worth of, uh, of, uh, punishment. Their careers, as you mentioned, are essentially over. Uh, and you know, we're, we're done. It, it, it's done, done and dusted, everything's fine. Everybody go back to the pitch and, and, and, you know, we'll, we'll sing the Liga MX song and we'll sing the, uh, FIFA Fair Play (laughs) uh, song before we, we go out on the pitch and play.

Yes, that is right. That Santi Gimenez who's been tearing the Eredivisie a new one, um, who makes a big move, one that many thought wouldn't happen, $40 million to AC Milan to be their nine, to be the guy. Now, can we illustrate just quickly the rise of Santi Gimenez for maybe those who aren't as familiar with Santi Gimenez, what he's done in this brief time in the Eredivisie and why maybe that's surprising for a few?

There's not too many strikers in Mexico that have that same physical mold that a Santiago Gimenez has. He's, you know, over six feet tall, very strong, very quick off the ball, very smart when it comes to making decisions in the first, you know, milliseconds when he gets the ball. He's definitely one of a kind in the context of Mexican soccer. His father obviously played for Mexico, born in Argentina, as was Santi, but, uh, played for the Mexican national team back in the, uh, you know, 2010 World Cup cycle, Christian Jiménez. So there was a lot of interest in seeing what he would be able to make of himself in the early years in his career. I think when he went to, uh, the Eredivisie, eh, in, in the Netherlands, there were a few people who I think were still skeptical because he really hadn't exploded the way that he did, eh, at Feyenoord, uh, you know, when he was coming up at Cruz Azul. Not a lot of goals, not a lot of, um, big game impact, though he was part of the team that obviously won, uh, the league title for the first time in 25 years for Cruz Azul, right? So for me, when I saw him get to European soccer, it was very important that he get off to a quick start, and he definitely did. The offers started rolling in for him, and I think this summer, when, uh, Nottingham Forest at the, uh, over at the, uh, Premier League offered 33 million euros for him last August, it was really interesting to me that he, he, he sort of picked a spot. There were a lot of people in Mexico who did not agree with him turning down a Premier League team.

People are very excited, uh, uh, about Santi Gimenez. They gave him the number seven shirt, which was famously Andriy, you know, Shevchenko's shirt, uh, the famous Ukrainian player, baller. Uh, so they expect a lot of him. They, they want him to fulfill that $40 million, uh, price tag. A- a- and thus far, he's proven the part. You mentioned Santi Gimenez, um, and the people he needs around him. Uh, Santi Gimenez at the national team level, that's probably his only knock as a footballer. It's what he's not done at the national team level. And I, for a long time, maintained, "Well, you need the right players around you." But we are talking about CONCACAF. We are talking about you play against Central American, Caribbean countries. You play against, uh, w- we play weekend, you know, friendlies. And he's not always lived up to it. Can you maybe give the fans that are listening to us or the people listening to us a, a sense of, of what that's been like for the Mexican public to see this guy just scoring loads of goals? In the Eredivisie, in the Europa League, in the Champions League. I mean, the, the, the double he scored against Bayern Munich, the first goal where he takes it off the right, finishes with the left, was ridiculous. How was it that he can do this at the club level and then at the CONCACAF level with a team like Mexico where other players, other nines, have done it, Santi seems to be lacking, like, that part of the bargain with the Mexican public. H- how have you... How can you describe the relationship between the fan and Santi Gimenez in Mexico?

The relationship is still good, but obviously, Santiago Gimenez will be the first guy to tell you that he's not done even, you know, 1% of what he wants to do at the national team level compared to what he does at the club level. And you've laid out several reasons why that is. I think historically, and you played in CONCACAF, you played in those World Cup qualifiers, you've been all over the Caribbean and Central America and even parts of South America with Suriname and French Guiana and whatnot, that is a very, very difficult, very, very underrated place to play in the world when it comes to national team matches because the physicality of, of CONCACAF teams is pretty much unparalleled. The fact that Mexico is seen as a giant, as is the US, in that region, means that you're always going to be playing against teams that are going to favor muddying up the game, bringing eight, nine people behind the ball at all times, and, and creating very, very few opportunities for you to score. It's also kind of a no-win situation for Mexican strikers historically when they either do well or don't do well against CONCACAF teams. And I'll explain very quickly. You have a guy like Uriel Antuna who plays for Tigres, most of his goals, if not all of his goals at the national team level, have been against CONCACAF teams. He seemingly feasts on teams at the Gold Cup and at World Cup qualifiers and now, you know, obviously Mexico does not need to qualify for the World Cup, but you will get a game against Panama, El Salvador, what have you, every now and then, and he will usually do well. What fans and pundits will say is that, "Okay, can you do that against a top 10 team? Can you do that against an Argentina, against a Brazil, against a France?" And if the answer is no, then people will just catalog you as a CONCACAF player. What happens (laughs) when you've got a guy like Chicharito or Hugo Sanchez, two guys who, who also struggled, uh, mightily against some CONCACAF sides during their time with the national team, and now Santi Gimenez, when you can't even do it against those teams? Well, it's... Again, it's a double-edged sword because they say, "All right, how can you expect me to believe in you if you can't score against Panama, against Honduras, against Guatemala, et cetera?"