What were the challenges you were facing as a CEO?

Yeah, it's interesting.

So I, by the time I moved into the role as a CEO at Just Right Scotland, I'd been managing and leading yeah for something like 17 18 years at that point so I had quite a lot of experience under my belt as a senior manager part of a kind of senior team and very much felt had felt ready to move into that kind of CEO exec director type role for a while and and I should say before I go any further it was such a such a privilege to do that job and to lead the team that I led, no regrets at all about taking that on.

I think that there are a number of, I suppose, structural challenges around leadership in the space that I was leading in, which have always been there, but I think have intensified in recent years.

So the economic environment that we're all operating in is very challenging.

Funding social justice work, funding charities has always been a really difficult challenge for anybody in that sector.

But in recent years, it's become very tight and very difficult and lots of organisations are having to restructure, cut staff and not be able to sustain services.

So in terms of the burnout not able to go on any in the way that you were any longer how did that manifest what did that look like?