Is there like a path? Like, like if one wants to be a cartoonist, what is the path? How does one break in and, and has it changed as far as you know? with the advent of whatever the technology of the day? What does one do to get better at it and get published and how does it work?

There's a lot of different questions in there.

I would say that in terms of doing it professionally, there's a lot of different ways you can be a cartoonist professionally.

Certainly the market has changed enormously with the advent of social media and everything.

But also, the 20 years before that, it was a dwindling market, at least in terms of gag cartooning, like the single panel New Yorker style things.

I mean, the New Yorker is kind of really the only game in town in terms of single panel gag cartoons.

There are other places that buy them, but it's like, you know, the New Yorker is like... you know it's always been the pinnacle but the mountain used to be a lot bigger yeah so in terms of like cartooning daily strips that kind of thing I don't really particularly know that much about like I know you know obviously there are syndicated strips a lot of them are kind of zombie strips that are like are you know properties that have existed forever and they have somebody else drawing them but you know graphic novels yeah there are some incredibly successful Instagram accounts.

How do you go about to like approaching people, going to publishers to publish like a cartoon or something like a comic strip or something small?

What was the inspiration? You had a house in Pennsylvania and were like, "What do, what do I do with this?" Or did you say, "I'm gonna buy a house in Pennsylvania expressly to do this?"

I said I'm going to buy a house in Pennsylvania expressly to do this.

Um, and in fact, I said I'm going to start a Kickstarter so that I am able to buy a house in Central Pennsylvania expressly, uh, to do this.

Um, so the house is in Williamsport, Pennsylvania, which is a, uh, lovely, lovely little city, like kinda smack in the middle of Pennsylvania.

Um, and we started going out there, like, over, over, like, that first big pandemic summer, um, and really fell in love with the place.

Um, and, uh, you know, I don't know if you do this, but every time I go someplace, I look at Realtor to be like, "What do houses cost here?" And it turns out, um, they are, relative to the East Coast, uh, very affordable.

So, um, I just got obsessed with the idea of kind of doing something out there.

... or whether you're, whether you really feel like it's an uphill battle and, and the people that are coming to you are, are they even, are they even sure what they're, what they're getting into?