What was your kind of, uh, maybe blemish or fatal flaw potentially for the Cincinnati Bengals, Derek?

Yeah, this is a, a little bit different, but in some ways similar to the Vikings thing.

I think I'm just, like, the, the flexibility within the Bengals offense, I just don't believe in it.

A- and I think that, like, when we talk about this all the time, like, flexibility, especially in January, really matters.

And I think this Bengals offense, when you have Ja'Marr Chase and Tee Higgins out there and Joe Burrow's playing solid, it's an offense that, especially with their schedule this year and the defense playing a little bit better, you can totally win 11 to 12 games.

But I just think that when you run into the best teams over and over again in the playoffs, they are going to have answers for what is a pretty static and simple offense where they're back to, especially you saw it against Miami this week, it was their highest gun rate of the season.

They've already completely scrapped the under center stuff.

And I think you just, you just gave me one, one word here, and one name here, I think for your, your maybe [laughs] your fatal flaws for the Seahawks.

What was your kind of, uh, maybe blemish or fatal flaw potentially for the Cincinnati Bengals, Derek?

[clicks tongue] Yeah, this is a, a little bit different but in some ways similar to the Vikings thing.

I think I'm just like the, the flexibility within the Bengals offense, I just don't believe in it.

A- and I think that, like, when, we talk about this all the time, like flexibility, especially in January, really matters.

And I think this Bengals offense, when you have Ja'Marr Chase and Tee Higgins out there and Joe Burrow's playing solid, it's an offense that, especially with their schedule this year and the defense playing a little bit better, you can totally win 11 to 12 games.

But I just think that when you run into the best teams over and over again in the playoffs, they are going to have answers for what is a pretty static and simple offense where they're back to, especially you saw it against Miami this week, it was their highest gun rate of the season.

They've already completely scrapped the under center stuff.

And I think you just, you just gave me one, one word here, and one name here, I think for your, your maybe [laughs] your fatal flaws for the Seahawks.

Yeah.

They were, uh, like so mu- And th- there wasn't necessarily boots so they could throw a 30-yard sail route.

It was a lot of boots just to get stuff in the flat and, and get a move in.

But they are not really doing that nearly as much, uh, last year.

Like, so far this season, they've only done it about two and a half-ish times a game, which is middle of the pack.

And I, I think that there are a few reasons for that.

But one of them, I'm guessing, is they do not necessarily want Stafford on, on the hoof as much as, as they had in the past.

Mm-hmm.

We're gonna talk about that.

Yeah.

But I think the draft prior stuff is...

Like, this sounds ridiculous, but, like, it's valid.

Those guys go that high in the draft because they are really talented, and I do think that that's where it started for me with Trevor, is like, he's a really good athlete.

He is, like, 6'5", he, uh, like 215 pounds.

He's a really explosive, not just mover, but thrower.

I think we could be a little bit better in how we handle some of that tension.

So what do you see-- what did you see with the Niner run game last year? Um, what do you think about their prospects of being able to run it at Seattle's defense this year?

Yeah, I, I think you kind of touched on all of it, and then at that point it's just a matter of trying to divvy up which percentage of the pie is what.

I would say about 70% of it is just the quality of the offensive line at this point.

And I don't think Shanahan has ever really had a truly great offensive line with San Francisco, but it's, it's-- he's always gotten the most out of what he's had, and I think we've always, you know, valued and appreciated him for that.

But at a certain point, you know, they've just lost a couple of guys over the years.

Trent Williams is getting older.

He's been banged up.

What do you think of this transition from Saleh to Raheem? What is the, you know, the novice fan gonna notice? And, and, and do you think the Niners have the horses on the back end to play a lot more man coverage?

Just talk a little bit about why you think Evans and his play style is better suited for a quarterback like Brock Purdy than even Brandon Aiyuk when he was second team All-Pro, 'cause I know that's something that you breached on the show a little bit.

Yeah, I think it's just kind of a little bit about where the league is going, and I think where Kyle Shanahan's offense is going.

You know, I think when we try to think back of what the offense was even as recently as, like, three years ago, you know, even the first Brock Purdy year I think, but obviously all the years with Jimor- Jimmy Garoppolo before that, it was a lot more condensed formations.

They were trying to run a lot of these end breakers, a lot of them off of play action.

It was like a very slash into zones, create yak style of offense, and they obviously still do some of that now with Brock Purdy.

But I think because of Christian McCaffrey being such a good underneath threat and usable receiver, and their receiving corps not really having a true X receiver that I think you can just leave on the boundary, especially on the backside of, like, three by one, they really became this, like, two-by-two, everything is gonna be split field sort of, uh, of offense, and they're gonna get five out in the pattern and really utilize the running back that way.

And I think if they're gonna be more of a drop back style of offense like that, you still need a way to, to attack down the field, and I think last year they just didn't always have that with some of the guys in and out of the lineup.

What do you think of this transition from Saleh to Raheem? What is the, you know, the novice fan gonna notice? And, and, and do you think the Niners have the horses on the back end to play a lot more man coverage?

Do you agree with Nate? Do you, are you as high on him? Do you see any weaknesses, uh, on this st- on this offense that concern you? What's your, how do you feel?

I think I'd be too scared to rank them first, but I do think that they are one of the four, five, six offenses that if they finish the year in first, I would not be that surprised.

Because I do think that there's a world where the offensive line really does start to gel.

Like, Tyler Smith is already fantastic, but I think Cooper Beebe is, is really good.

Uh, uh, Steele actually played, I think, a little bit better last year.

Tyler Booker, we'll, we'll see.

I think he showed some flashes.

[chuckles]

Yeah

... are just like, "Oh my God." Like, he, it...

Sometimes the velocity is great.

He really will push the ball down the field.

Some of his best stuff looks awesome.

But I think there's just a lot of gaps to be filled in for the rest of his tape, but then also, like, the rest of his profile 'cause, like, my other starting point with him is, like, he's obviously an older prospect.

He's only a one-year starter.

Yeah.

Okay.

Yes.

Like, I think the tackles are really, really good.

I think the center, uh, I, I, I think their center guard situation, like with Josh Myers and, and Joe Tippman, I think has been settled and so I know that John Simpson is gonna be a free agent after this year, but, like, I do think the offensive line is really good and I think their run game does kick ass, it's just the passing game was so bad and the defense, especially down the stretch, was so bad that we just didn't really get to feel the value of it.

But I real- I really do think this offensive line can kick some ass and, like, Mbeu's already good but if he takes any sort of step, I think that that's gonna go a long way, like, I think, uh, Olu Fashanu probably still has some more development in him, he's a young player.

Like I ...

Tippman obviously only moved to guard this year.

He's at least fun.

All right, we're gonna take one more quick break and then come back and chat a little Monday morning.

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Ed Ingram de- ... completed Jermaine Pratt on like a 15 yard Woody Marks run in this game, and I do think that even if the Texans offense isn't, you know, this great unit or operating on all cylinders at this point, I still feel like they've improved enough where it makes them interesting in the AFC South as currently constructed.

I agree, and I think that that's probably only gonna become more true as Stroud starts to play again.

I mean, he hasn't played in a month basically, and I think you saw that especially early in this game, like he just felt a little bit uncomfortable, I think not fully himself and started to ease himself into it, which completely makes sense.

So, I think you add on top of, outside of the Seattle game, the, the way that Stroud had been playing before he got hurt and then I think the way that he played in the second half of this game, on top of, you mentioned the offensive line, it's not just that they are gelling from one of the worst in the league to, like, moderately functional, but they don't really play any, like, fierce pass rushes over the next five or six weeks.

Like they play Kansas City, they play Arizona, Las Vegas, uh, the Chargers in Indianapolis again.

So like there's some decent stuff in there, but you're not playing the Seahawks or, or anything like that.

And so, I think they should be able to give Stroud enough chances to live, and then, again, the run game has gone from, I'm not gonna call it good, but them like at least starting to knock on the door of, like, 38% rushing success rate, which is, like, slightly below average kind of functional as opposed to being one of the worst the way that they were last year and early this year.

Yeah.

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How often does that happen against the Lions?

One, one, how often does that happen against the Lions? And, like, how often has that happened for this version of the Vikings? Like, maybe one or two weeks early in the season they got some of that with their offensive line, but for the most part this has been, like, their fronts, both of the fronts that they paid for, have not been as good as I think that they wanted them to be.

And so I thought the run game today...

One, it wasn't just that it was effective, is that it was very...

It was varied.

Like, they did a lot of interesting pulling stuff, they hit some basic zone stuff.

Uh, they had an awesome duo run for Jordan Mason towards the end of the game, like with about 4 minutes left in the fourth quarter, which was the ultimate, like...

Yeah.

So now, the way that the Bills are constructed, do you feel like they are equipped to try out that game plan again, and do you still think that's the best way to approach this version of the Chiefs offense?

I think if you have the horses, it is probably the best way to approach this offense.

I'm just not confident that this Bills defense as it's currently constructed really does.

Like, I'm still pretty worried about the cornerback two spot, and I know we might get some Maxwell Hairston in this game to potentially see if he can really be that guy for them, but that is a I've-gotta-wait-and-see-it type of deal for- for this Bills defense.

And so, I think I just struggle with a lot of the other parts of- of what they're gonna get going.

I think there's a chance that on the edges they can get some pass rush pressure, um, even with just some of their rush four stuff, like I think we saw last week even Washington was able to do that.

But I actually feel even with Trey Smith's status a little bit, uh, up in the air for this game, the Chiefs' interior offensive line is awesome, and I think with that being the case, one, it's gonna provide Mahomes some stability there, and he's shown his ability to step up in the pocket this season, but it also just makes the pass ru- or the pass protection plan easier in the sense of, like, we don't have to worry about trying to fix the interior.

So Derek, when you watch the Bills offense right now in Josh Allen, what is your sense of maybe what feels a little bit unsettled and maybe why they don't feel cri- quite as crisp as they do at their best?

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What did you see from the Texans yesterday that might give you a little bit of hope moving forward about why this could be different? Was there anything? Was there anything you saw from the offense in particular that was like, "Okay, maybe they're finding something they can hopefully tap into a little bit"?

I honestly did not come away very enthused with the way that this game went.

I mean, they didn't score any of their touchdowns until the fourth quarter.

Um, again...

And I, like, I like this Titans defense.

You should be able to score against this Titans defense a little bit earlier than that.

And I know that they've had some other issues, but I came away more concerned with, one, the way that the passing game was operating, to me, was very frustrating.

Where are you at with the Tennessee Titans offense right now? Like when you watch this group, which down to down has been the worst in the NFL to this point, and you watch them on Sunday, what do you think is the main thing that currently plagues them?

What are you excited to watch with the 2025 Jaguars?

I'm very excited to watch what Trevor Lawrence looks like in an offense that does not put him in a box by virtue of the other limitations in the offense.

It, it, that's probably the best way that I can frame it.

It, kind of similarly to the way that we were talking about C.J. Stroud and, like, what I mean by that is even when C.J. Strou- or even when Trevor Lawrence was good in 2022, it was a lot of the s- like s- more spread than other teams.

They were really pass heavy.

Um, it was a lot of the RPO stuff, and that just felt like, you know, Trevor is good at that stuff, but I would have liked them to marry stuff to what feels like a little bit more of an NFL offense.

In 2024, they kind of tried to do that, but the offensive line was so bad and the run game was so bad that Trevor kinda just felt like he constantly had to, okay, one, two, three, four, five, drop back, instantly chuck the ball 20 yards down the field.

The swing point for you with the 2025 Tennessee Titans is what?

So this being like a top 10, defined top 10 offensive line, that's just as much a part of my enthusiasm for what this group can be as the introduction of Cam Ward is.

I get all of that 'cause I really, that was the part that I think when I looked at the Titan's roster, immediately after the draft and trying to do just immediate like gut check, how do I feel, compared to when you can marinate on it through mid-July and all that stuff, I- I really started to come around on the offensive line.

'Cause I think if Dan Moore had been on this offensive line last year, I don't know, he would've been probably, given a- given some of the injuries and stuff like that, probably their third-best offensive lineman, when I think if Dan Moore is your third-best offensive lineman, that's not the greatest spot to be in, but he could potentially, as we've talked about before, he might be their worst offensive lineman now if everyone's healthy.

Which, if he's your worst offensive lineman, you're probably in a pretty good spot, and I'm so glad you mentioned, like, Latham getting to play next to more of a veteran this year 'cause Skowronski, I think, is a, a, is a fine player, but Latham having to, one, switch sides next, last year, and then also play next to a very young player with their starting center out for a lot of the season, it's just like, and a quarterback who I don't think was really helping them in terms of setting their protections and really making sure everything, everybody knows what's going on, it's just like, he's kinda just swimming and hoping that physically he could, he could get it done, and you saw some of the flashes, but again, it was, it was a little bit more up and down than you want.

So, I'm very bullish on where I think the offensive line is going, and if they can get a little bit more balance in the run game and not have to make Cam Ward be a superhero and, like, actually give him a little bit more of...

It's not gonna be 2016 Dak Prescott, but ag- if you can at least give him some degree of help where he just doesn't have to feel like a hero all the time and throw some of the ridiculous interceptions in the second quarter the way he did in college, then I do think that this could go a pretty long way.

My question for you is...

I like Mikell Williams too, but...

When we n- when teams know we are going to throw the ball, how capable are we of being a good passing offense? And there are layers to why they've struggled in that area, and we can talk about that, but that's still, another year into the system, is the biggest jump or the biggest area of improvement that we need to see from Kyler Murray.

That's such a way great- great way to frame it, and I do think over the years we have seen some improvement, right? Like I think he's a better quick game passer now than he was, you know, two, two years into his career.

I think he's significantly better at that.

Um, and then I think even again some of it isn't really on Kyler Murray.

Like I think we all had the why is Marvin Harrison Jr. being used this way type of deal, and then even beyond that it's like they didn't even really have a good wide receiver three for a lot of the season.

Like I like Michael Wilson as a two, but their three was supposed to be Zay Jones.

He was kind of banged up for a lot of the season.

Why Brock Purdy?

(laughs)

Yeah, he, he doesn't get to apply.

Um, but Chris Jenkins to me is like...

The pass rush stuff is actually a good point that, especially if you're a young player and you're constantly being deployed in a system like this where they're asking you to stunt a lot, uh, to twist a lot, it's not just that those plays are kind of inherently designed to get somebody else, you know, open, so to speak, in, in terms of the pressure.

It's also like then you just get fewer regular pass rush snaps to, like, hone your skill and, and develop that.

And so I think you could start to explain away why that hurt him, and maybe them bringing in Al Golden and, and running some similar pressure packages is gonna help him there.

I think the run defense is, is more important.

(laughs)

(laughs)

... bit different.

Th- that's, like, a little bit too far.

That's like the Brett Favre school of quarterbacking.

And there's, there's...

I love it, but y- you don't need to, to, you don't need to be in that tier necessarily.

Tier four is the guys who are still willing to hang into the pocket, guys who are willing to take hits, guys who are willing to extend the plays and really be a little bit more creative, and guys who are, again, willing to throw with anticipation to every level of the field.

All right.

(laughs)

Look, I, I'm a big believer that, uh, top five you draft players not positions.

And to go get a guy like Ash and Gentry, regardless of how you view the running back position, to go get a difference maker, I mean, you package one of those twos, maybe throw in another sweetener to go from 10 to four, that might be enough for the Patriots.

I- it'll be interesting to see the discount that there's, we have with trades this year.

Like, obviously you, you're gonna pay attention to the trade chart, but maybe you are more inclined, if you're the Patriots or one of these other teams, to take just a little bit less to go back and get more draft capital and still feel like you're getting...

All right, you know, we, we really like Ndombou and Banks and Conner Lee and so we know we're gonna get a tackle at 10.

Um, that one, that, that...

Right.