That's pretty much it, isn't it?

That's pretty much it, yeah.

There, there are a few variations on the team, but, um, uh, uh, certainly with regards to UNIFIL, um, it's not, you know, the, the end of that mission, uh, is significant for, for Lebanon and for stability in the Middle East.

Uh, and it's really pointing out, sadly, that the UN has now entered what I would describe as League of Nations territory.

Uh, m- I'm referring to the, its, the UN's predecessor, the League of Nations, in the 1930s, when it became a moribund institution.

And unfortunately, [clears throat] with regards to conflict management, that's, uh, that's where we're at.

And what that really means is, a- and what I suppose the centrality of the debate that's going on about the Triple Lock is, if Ireland wants to continue to be a player in peacekeeping and conflict management and resolution, we are either going to want to continue doing it through the mechanism of the UN, which is what the, a lot of the opposition are talking about, in very loaded and emotional terms, or we try and diversify, which is what people, including myself, who are experienced in how this works, uh, are saying that that's the way the world is changing and moving towards.

What would be the impact if it was the case that, um, the state decided to retain the triple lock, as you said, there hasn't been a new peacekeeping mission in 15 years, and that continued? In other words, what would the impact be on the defense forces if overseas deployments dried up?

Declan, an important piece of infrastructure for Drogheda.

Absolutely, Adrian.

Good morning.

Yeah, look, this has been in the pipeline for a while now and it's just such a really positive development for Drogheda.

As you've mentioned in your intro, it links the Newtown Link Road and the L2307 Road and the surrounding areas, just making it easier, making it easier and safer for people to travel to work and just access to local businesses.

I mean, one of our biggest employment hubs in Drogheda is the Blind Business Park as well.

And this is going to make it so easier for those going to and from work, but also for pedestrians and cyclists who now have that option of getting to work that way, because anyone who's ever travelled on the kind of the old Green Hills Road, as I would call it, were really taking their life at risk.

This new road has great business potential.

Jacqueline, you want to come in? Yeah,

I think it begs the question, just to extend Ronan's point.

What does productivity look like? That's the key question.

And strategically, we don't seem to be addressing that in society.

And to come back to Liz's point, within education, there is a real fear.

I do some work in education myself, and there's a real fear of the metrics dominating things.

So stick an hour in here that has to be filled because it looks good.

victims who will have been inspired by Donaldson's victims but also Declan Parr another you know towering figure who went to jail George Gibney Alison O'Connor writing about that today

What would you like to see being developed?

I think t- the important thing, I suppose, Adrian, at this point, is to really to acknowledge the tremendous work that's already happening in Drogheda.

And we're fortunate to have a huge amount of outstanding sporting organizations, youth groups, and community projects, and that are all volunteer-led, who provide just thousands of opportunities for, for young people every single week in our, in our town.

Um, I would have met with, um, Cora Noad from the Boomerang Youth Cafe.

And the youth cafe just a, a tremendous, uh, facility i- in town.

But not everybody's into, into sport.

Uh, the, the Boomerang You- Boomerang Youth Cafe provide music opportunities, and learning opportunities, and, uh, coming together and creating friendships, and it's, it's, it's centers like that.

How do you persuade, and w- uh, who is responsible for persuading those young people that are involved in antisocial behavior that there's, there's much more out there for you? Uh, is that responsibility on the local authority? Is it on teachers? Is it on parents? Who does it fall on?

are you? So as Tara was giving her reaction to the idea of 1,000 Gardaí being recruited over the course of the next year and casting quite a bit of doubt on the prospects of that happening, your reaction to the provision for 850 new permanent Defence Force members going forward, how confident would you be of the state being able to procure said recruits?

I would be reasonably optimistic.

I think if it's communicated the right way, I think a lot of young Irish people are interested in serving in the Defence Forces.

If a path to a decent career can be demonstrated to them.

And I don't think that has been the case in recent times.

But that has certainly changed.

I know the Defence Forces themselves... have been taking steps to communicate these kinds of things better.

We're never going to have

Declan, this is quite a complex operation, or is it? Is the fact that it's kind of confined to two areas, the Phoenix Park and then later on the golf course in Doonbeg, does that make it more straightforward for the Gardaí?

Good afternoon, Shane.

Well, it swings and roundabouts, really.

During the Biden visit, there were far more locations and that made things logistically more difficult.

However, the Biden visit took place at a different time geopolitically.

So I would argue that this is also complicated by the EU presidency, which already has a high tempo of operational activity for security forces.

And happening against that backdrop It makes it a little bit more complicated, but then there is also the advantage that the fact that there's a lot of things in play anyway, so it's easier to adapt to the higher tempo for the visit.

He's certainly talking tough.

How will that all be coordinated?

Well, the coordination initially takes place between the planners on the US side and the Irish side.

And 4,000 personnel is not...

It's not ridiculously out of proportion when you think about the amount of people that would be needed to secure areas in the Doonbeg area because, as I said, there's a lot of wide open spaces.

So you will need a lot of uniformed guard standing on roadblocks to close off areas, not just physically close them off, but to have the authority of the state to do so.

The guard that is the agent of law enforcement in the state and he or she has that authority to redirect ordinary citizens.

So that's a crucial element.

Ireland and the

And I imagine the logistics involved in all of this being huge.

Absolutely.

Yeah, you've put your finger on it.

I'm afraid that's the kind of figure you're talking about to complete an operation of that nature.

People, I think, get fixated about something like this in terms of what they can actually see.

But it's like an iceberg.

You're just seeing the tip of it when you see the guard, the patrols or the aircraft activity.

And whilst America is an ally of ours, there are many people in both Ireland and indeed throughout Europe who would not be fans of Donald Trump, to put it mildly.

what is the issue there? Is it the fact that there is one road in and one road out?

Yeah, one rode in, one rode out.

We have raised this on numerous occasions with accountants.

This is before the new Tesco went in.

We could foresee that this was going to be an issue and it was coming back that it wasn't going to be an issue.

And of course, Tesco is built and Yeah, and traffic just escalates.

I mean, every archery coming out of that M1 retail park, as you come out of it, it kind of creeps into, goes one lane and then just into a second lane as you come out and you're hitting a couple of roundabouts there.

one of the things being looked at and being considered is a separate entrance and exit, is it?

However, their abilities

in the hybrid sphere are much more sophisticated and advanced.

capable and competent.

And they're using a mixture of things.

If you think about what they've been doing on the borders of Finland, massing conventional forces, causing the Finns to have to reinforce that border.

Then these deniable attacks in Germany.

And the beauty of hybrid warfare is it pressures the person who has been aggressed against to try and establish what happened.

they can

Declan, was Kaja Callas being diplomatic and very kind to us when she said that we had better neighbours and that was one reason, along with our neutrality for our lower spending on defence?

Well, the issue has been very factual anyway, Shane.

There's no doubt about that.

I mean, true to the matter is that Irish defence policy has always been predicated on relying on the protection of the UK, the US and Europe in one shape or form or another without having to answer any hard questions.

And, you know, it allowed us to keep it in a sort of a grey area, but everybody understood knowing that we were on a particular side.

I think at the end of the day, though, I think everybody accepts the realities of the situation.

Most people who live in the real world do.

It's not a great look, is it?

Do you have to actually get up and touch someone with this glove?

You do, but it's much more simple than a taser.

A taser has to be...

There's more training and there's more responsibility required in operating a taser.

Um, and it is a, a form of a, a firearm.

Uh, the glove is, it's a part of what are the suite of options of what are now called less lethal weapons.

So giving people, whether they're law enforcement or, or other people who would have to deal with violent individuals, an option, uh, other than a firearm.

... uh, uh, es- especially in relation to ICE given that, that, uh, um, uh, the, there's perhaps a slight inclination to use more lethal force.

Do you have to actually get up and touch someone with this glove?

You do, but it's much more simple than a taser.

A taser has to be, there's more training and there's more responsibility required in operating a taser.

And it is a form of firearm.

The glove is, it's a part of what are the suite of options of what are now called less lethal weapons.

So giving people, whether they're law enforcement or other people who would have to deal with violent individuals, an option.

other than a firearm.

And I suppose you can see the logic of that, especially in relation to ice, given that there's perhaps a slight inclination to use more lethal force.

what we're

going to see i think i think one of our biggest uh investment is is our infrastructure in terms of the panker and the panker as people know is it's a it's it's our road infrastructure that north of draught and that has opened up a huge amount of land banks for for housing developments so that is that i mean that panker and and the housing development uh is phenomenal you know um And that has been such a godsend for those in need of housing.

As you come into the town centre, we're funding an application for a Westgate vision plan.

Westgate House and the old Droughty Ute building are also under construction.

We see the old Abbey.

The Abbey was now purchased the other day.

We're moving on purchasing buildings on narrow West Street and 18 buildings in conjunction with draw the bids and with our business owners are getting cosmetic paint makeovers.

I've spoken to you before about city status for uh drada and we talked about how the government plans to introduce town councils again instead and you indicated to me a couple of weeks ago but that's enough for now that's a step in that direction the city status campaign group say no we need to head towards a city for drada first

Does that genuinely apply here?

Look, I think there's a degree of hype, um, that has been going on about security operations, I think because of the new presidency, because of [clears throat] the likelihood now it seems of President Trump coming to, uh, to visit, uh, for the, the Gulf.

But what makes this unprecedented, the Keenan operation, is not so much the securing of him on Irish soil.

I think that is reasonably straightforward for An Garda Síochána.

It's not their first rodeo with these kinds of things.

Uh, and I think that some things have been exaggerated, uh, and some things underplayed, which I'll expand on in a moment.

But [clears throat] the, the key, um, aspect of this that is maybe more complex and slightly newer, uh, to the Irish State is the transport of Keenan, uh, in a secure fashion using the forces of the state, obviously, uh, the Air Corps and An Garda Síochána.

So has the idea of an untouchable Irish crime boss living openly overseas effectively come to an end?

And Declan, let me firstly ask you, when are we expecting Donald Trump to arrive in Ireland?

Well, uh, it's, it hasn't been officially announced as regards dates, but obviously, it will be in line with, uh, the, the forthcoming golfing competition and around that period.

There, there, there has been nothing formally published about this.

I think the crux of this, uh, in terms of how we comprehend it, is that it's not an official state visit, or certainly hasn't been, uh, there has been no indication of that.

And therefore, that it's very much appears to be and, uh, focused on attending the competition itself and all, uh, that's surrounding it.

And if we remember back to the Taoiseach's invitation in, uh, on March seventeenth, on St. Patrick's Day, it was an invitation, uh, specifically around, uh, the golf, which was, uh, probably [clears throat] a good diplomatic move by the Taoiseach in that rather than just extend a general invitation to, uh, President Trump, he was, uh, being specific because he knew of President Trump's interest and love for golf.

Now, the reason I'm focusing on that is, from a security planning point of view, it could turn out to be significant in that [lips smack] if everything is focused around that part of the country, and indeed Doonbeg, uh, it considerably reduces the headaches for security planners.

Would he meet, for example, President Connolly?

And that is how can you then bridge the gap to return to the negotiation table if that's the rhetoric? Or do the Iranians, are they that pragmatic that they won't take offense to that?

No, I don't believe they'll take offense to that.

I mean, we're well used to Trump's rhetoric now at this stage.

And to be quite honest, if you look at the track record of the rhetoric the Iranians have used, especially since the Ayatollah Khomeini came into power in 1979, it was far from sanguine or tranquil.

I mean, they've been calling the US in particular and the West in general all kinds of names.

It goes with their culture.

So I think Trump is just talking in a language that they understand.

constructing a playbook to rely on Donald Trump in any way sounds like potentially a short-sighted plan considering that it could blow up in our face very quickly considering the individual at play.

Okay.

But it is reminding us, though, is we need to be aware that a country like ours, no matter how much we invest in our defense budget, can manage this kind of thing on its own.

Because to come back to John Mooney's piece, it's not all about bombs and bullets.

It's not always going to be [clears throat] purely a Garda and military, uh, response.

Disinformation operations, which the Russians are very good at.

They're not good at a lot of other things, thankfully, as we see in Ukraine, but they are good at sowing seeds of dissent, and that's easily done.

You latch onto whatever the issues of concern are in a country, and you ramp up the volume about them online and increase the toxicity.

But he's not gonna win if the criminal legal aid system completely falls apart.

How, how big a risk do you see the cyber threat p- in particular?

Um, I see the, uh, you see, I mean, I, I see it as a significant threat because we're vulnerable.

Uh, and no matter how much preparation, uh, we would've had for this, w- y- you know, there are large infrastructural issues that we, uh, we have to address going forward.

And, you know, uh, the, we're vulnerable at, at all levels, but then most countries would be.

There's, this, the nature of these threats, as has been shown in previous, uh, presidencies, uh, it's impossible to be able to, uh, to pin them all down no matter how, uh, even if it's a well-resourced country.

And then it depends on, uh, uh, on the particular timing.

It depends on that particular country and its, uh, its particular set of challenges.

I was gonna ask, what are those experiences in, in the likes of Denmark and Romania?

Do you expect much in the way of pushback if the government tries to remove it?

I think there'll be a lot of heat and very little light in the Dáil in the debate about this.

Yes, the coalition or rather the opposition have chosen to coalesce around this and to turn it into a very emotional factor in how they present it to the Irish public.

But I think the government are committed to pushing ahead of this.

They have the numbers in the Dáil and I think they will go ahead.

And it needs to go ahead because what people, what your listeners out there need to understand And they're not being told this by the opposition.

This has become an anvil around our neck from an international perspective and has made us unreliable actors for missions.

Will people see this as the thin end of a wedge that allows us to militarise in a way that most people are not comfortable with in this country?

Yeah, because I do remember some years ago I was in Somalia and, you know, all the press who were there, they insisted we wear these flak jackets, but it didn't seem to be the case that they thought somebody was going to try and shoot us per se, but that we might get caught in a situation or there might be an explosion.

Yeah.

Again, you know, the term that people might be familiar with hearing, flak vests.

I mean, they were designed originally to protect soldiers from shrapnel.

That was what you could, the best you could expect.

No more than a helmet.

I mean, People assume a helmet protects you from, you know, helmets have improved hugely, but it's mostly shrapnel that they'll protect you from.

them.

Declan, what purpose does it serve if it can't protect a multiplicity of locations and if it can't shoot down drones?

Well, Anton, it does serve a purpose, but I think we need to get things in perspective.

There's a certain amount of hysteria and hyperbole entering this whole discussion of late.

So certainly the defence forces have gone on record as saying that they can only protect one location at a time with the equipment and technology that they have.

OK, that's what we're dealing with.

We're going to have to have assistance.

The reality is that there's two layers to this.

Does that go some way towards ending our vulnerability or reducing our vulnerability, the kind of vulnerability Cian was talking about?

Good morning.

Yeah, well, let's just say it's a step in the right direction.

Let's not get too carried away here.

I mean, this money, these are monies that were supposed to be ring-fenced anyway.

The purchase of the radar has been an ongoing project for some years, the primary radar.

The purchase of sonar, the replenishment of the armoured fleet for the defence forces, and various other elements thereof.

Declan, just if you will, describe to us lay people what those drones were doing last Monday night and who you think were responsible.

Sure.

Well, the drones were operating in the vicinity of the naval vessel, the L.E. William Butcher Yates.

And as we now know, that was some distance offshore within Irish territorial waters.

The whole manner and conduct of how the drones were being operated indicated a degree of coordination, indicated a degree of coordination.

skill and usage that was not typical of people that were just engaged in trying to buzz the area or engaging in some kind of mischievous activity.

There was a coordinated approach to this.

you about that? Because there was a report in the Irish Times on Saturday about significant annoyance among senior guard officers that the defence forces did not open fire on the drones or even fire warning shots.

Now, how did you come up with the concept or where did you hear about this concept?

I suppose this has been rolled out right across the UK.

It's in the north of Ireland.

And more recently, Fingal County Council have rolled it out in some parts of their areas as well, like Malahide and Portmarnock.

And I love these type of simple ideas.

And I'm not one for reinventing the wheel, but sometimes we can often make that wheel a little bit better.

It really is just such a simple idea with a powerful purpose.

But it's to try and get them to come back out.