i've been surprised by that i i always assumed the goal would be a perfectly logical backing and you're right i i was kind of flummoxed by that as well

Stablecoins essentially are savings instruments.

And you can save in ETFs, as I've just described, or you can save in stablecoins.

But essentially, the utility aspects of them are questionable.

But anyway, putting that aside, we didn't think that the world was going to rush out and buy a gold stablecoin with a World Gold Council title on it.

especially as they hadn't rushed out and bought a JP Morgan stablecoin or etc.

And I managed to get that across to my board.

You said the latent demand that might be out there, about two thirds of it, are people who just don't trade gold now.

Now, to what extent is this analysis right, and to what extent is it wrong? What did they get right, and why are we not in a bunker today?

We're not in a bunker today because, very much personal view, the fact that we haven't reached the point at which that spiral occurs, when the interest cannot be afforded.

US is about to go through a trillion dollars worth of annual debt repayment.

It's enormous.

If that yield curve shifts and interest rates go up, let's say you have an enormous inflation spike that forces everything up, that cost does reach a point where it runs away, and then it becomes quite a terrifying scenario.

How do you solve that, the bunker moment? Because what do you do? Do you all sit round a table and de- forgive each other? The wealth destruction across the world is immense.

So I think people in the know are very scared of that f- that point coming, and when you see various government spending on, on, even if it's defense, which is necessary, as an example, you're seeing longer dated yield curves keep tipping up, keep ticking up, keep ticking up.

Why are you here at a crypto conference? [laughs]

But outline for me the point you made there about why potentially Japanese investors might be about to buy a lot more gold than they have.

And we've seen this over the last 18 months in particular.

It occurred to me that there is a vast amount of money being held by old people in Japan, generational change.

I mean, quite literally, and depending on who you talk to, and I might get this number wrong, but 50% of all of it's in cash held at home, quite literally under the mattress.

That generation have obviously been very defensive, and a young generation are appearing on the scene, and that money is going to get passed down to them.

In my opinion, those people are far more adept.

They have electronics.

Is it wrong to say that it applies more broadly than that, i.e., we might have a recession, but when we come out of the recession, if growth is looking good, if things are all right, will gold take a pause? Or do you think that that is too simple a kind of perspective on gold?