Mm.

So I thought, "Interesting." And I- that's how I started, and every time I would withdraw, I would just speak to the truth of it's like, "I don't wanna be here.

I don't like any of you, and I don't like me.

All I wanna do is run for the hills." And as I started to speak about it, it was like tss, I would release a little bit of the pressure.

It was what she called getting to the other side.

She was like, "You gotta act as if until you can get to the side." So as I began to come out of my shell and start to, you know, maybe ask a question and share with what I, what was going on with me, like the fact that the entire day leading up to our meeting, all I wanted to do was call and say, "I ain't coming.

I'm not gonna be there." But I, here I am.

So in marriage, what can happen when one spouse is in a group where they are growing and becoming a new person, while the other spouse is still the old person, and they're still carrying these old memories, basically holding the ne- the one who's growing back? How can they handle that situation?

So why don't you tell me a little bit more about yourself and your journey and how you ended up living in the mountains and writing books?

Well, thank you for having me on, Robin.

So my parents were adventurous.

There was four kids.

My father was working for his mother-in-law and had to get out from under her thumb.

So they had this great vision.

My mother wanted to move to a mountain town, a resort town, and build a ski lodge and start a writer's foundation.

And then is that when you met your mentor who helped pull you out of that and show you, reflect back to you the good parts of you? What was that like? What did that change?

You have the floor.

Thank you.

So from a very young age, I was a feeling kid and took everything personally.

And it worked against me in a lot of ways.

But I from also from a young age, I was very much on my own.

It was five kids and two cousins that lived with us.

And we had a ski lodge in the mountains of Colorado.

What steps did she do to you to make you who you are?

Mm.

'Cause I thought, "Well, learn about movies.

I'll watch a lot of movies.

It'll help me screen write." So I ended up going to Tahoe and working with a friend, siding a house.

He was a, I was a carpenter, he was too.

So I went to one day of a writer's conference and met this woman, and we sort of fell into bed and fell into a working relationship.

She was a business writer and a novelist.

[laughs]

Mm.

'Cause I thought, well, learn about movies.

I watched a lot of movies.

It'll help me screen write.

So I ended up going to Tahoe and working with a friend siding a house.

He was a, I was a carpenter, he was too.

So I went to one day of a writer's conference and met this woman, and we sort of fell into bed and fell into a working relationship.

[laughs]