So where's the Jewish angle at Matisse at war?

A couple of different angles, Herschel.

Matisse's dealer, Paul Rosenberg, was one of the victims when the Germans occupied Paris.

Paul Rosenberg, a very good friend of Matisse, among other famous modernist artists, was hounded, really had to flee to the United States.

His apartment was looted, his gallery was looted, and it was Paul Rosenberg... from whom so many famous paintings were stolen, some of which took decades to be repatriated.

Matisse and Bonnard and other famous painters at the time were friends with the Bernheim-Jean family, the Bernheim family, and at one point Matisse and Bonnard put together basically a letter, a series of letters to Bonnard to really try and stanch or stop the persecution of their friends down in the Vichy part of France.

That's the collaborations part of France.

Well, the

Anna was born in Hungary, and when her family was forced to go in search of a fresh start, they immigrated to the United States.

Her family was exiled from Budapest, Hungary by a disagreement that her father had.

He had worked for the emperor and the emperor had a disagreement with her father and the next thing you know he was on a ship to New York.

And there was a change of circumstances.

The Lederer family had been middle class in Budapest and Papa Lederer in New York was not.

He took a job in the needle trades and a couple years later was able to call for his family.

Anna arrived at Ellis Island, Anna, her sister and mother.

Her notoriety quickly rose from local to national when she formed a partnership working with the International Ladies Garment Workers Union, as well as many other high-profile labor and union organizations.

What do we know about Matisse? I mean, is he just hiding himself away, only interested in his own painting? Or is he thinking, how do I navigate these awful conditions to communicate with my artwork, but not be arrested.

I think clearly he was wrestling with the war and anxiety over the fate of his sons, his daughter, his family and his friends.

I mean, his dealer, Paul Rosenberg, obviously came, you know, had to flee to the United States and his gallery in Paris was looted.

So and other friends of Matisse who were in harm's way in the occupied zone.

And, you know, I go back, Phil and Laura, all the way to his sort of massive paintings from World War I.

You know, Bathers by the River, the Moroccans, the piano lesson.

And that was a real pivotal turn for him that left collectors and commentators sort of clueless or confounded because you have this...

Perhaps you could just explain a little bit more about, if you're standing next to the painting, what would you point our eyes towards?