And yes, again, another way of how you're framing the project as a win-win for everyone that's involved.

Yeah, Pierre, you hit the nail on the head with layer eight, right? Everybody thinks there's seven layers in the OSI model.

Layer eight is the politics, right? And personalities that we have to deal with and the leadership level.

And JP, the CEO might be the final decision maker sometimes, but they're rarely, to Pierre's point, the only person who decides whether a proposal will move forward.

the key stakeholders are the people either from my experience control the money absorb the operational impact uh own some of the legal exposure or depend on the outcome that we're talking about so first i'd say the cfo matters a lot or whoever that money decision maker is not because every conversation is about dollars or costs but because every proposal is a capital allocation decision The CFO is asking, what does this protect and what's it cost and what's the trade-off? Then like Pierre said, the others involved, the COO or operational type of leaders are critical too.

They want to know whether this proposal is going to create friction for them, slow down delivery, mess up a workflow.

I've had this recently.

Brian, have you ever had to kind of like rein in some ideas as a CISO that might be coming from others when they're trying to present alternative tech strategy plans and you just kind of like bring your wait a minute, hang on, you know, here's what we need to actually think about before doing these things?