So explain how the activations, are you at the point where you think about that as, or do you not want that to be the sort of driver?

Yeah, it's definitely not the driver, as I said.

And I will totally agree with you.

I also disagree a little bit with Surfer's Journal being an example.

That's a magazine where, I mean, I don't know their demographics exactly, but you have a large subscriber base, an expensive brand that, I mean, I don't think they did activations for... well, probably very few activations.

They just create this beautiful long form surf magazine and with a very small staff and they have a very large subscriber base.

They have the model.

How do you solve for distribution? Yeah.

What are you seeing these days?

Yeah, that's a great question, John.

I mean, I think right now, you know, in today's world, in terms of where companies are with the challenges to recruit talent, develop talent, retain talent, and run profitable businesses, I think managers these days have more pressure and expectations on them than they ever had.

I think people managers are oftentimes individuals that are responsible for leading people, developing people, but they're also usually subject matter experts in an area.

So for us, we design and build the things, right? So our people managers are technical experts.

So we're always really cognizant and intentional around trying to balance what we expect our people managers to do.

And our people managers at times are going to be wearing many hats, right? They're going to be pulled into pursuing and proposing and selling work, to delivering and designing work, to be providing subject matter expertise, and then to manage people all on top of that.

What are some of the things you're doing to put that into practice?