So, Bijan, I mean, tell us about this, well, this Project Spire, as it's called, the Church of England Slavery Reparations Project, and why are you taking them to court over it?

Yes, well...

Just starting specifically, it's the church commissioners in particular.

I mean, remember, there's no legal entity called the Church of England for starters.

So the church commissioners are a body which administer the historic financial endowments of the Church of England.

They've got about £11.6 billion, which have been accumulated over a long period of time.

And their first incarnation was a body called the Queen Anne's Bounty, which was set up at the beginning of the 18th century.

And well, for much of society, that kind of identity politics has rather

That's an enormous transformation for how we see our responsibility to one another, isn't it?

Yes, I mean, we should put that in the context of the earliest ideas of customary law.

And even the first law code that we have in English dates back to 603 or thereabouts.

And it's the product of the Christian missionaries who come to King Ethelbert of Kent, prompting a writing down of the ideas of law.

But although the idea of the king as lawgiver is modelled on the Old Testament, those first laws were very much about retaliation and revenge.

So if someone is killed, it's not really the matter of the state as such.

It's the matter of the people who have been harmed or their relatives to seek redress.

Tell us about that.