I know it's crazy, but I always see the operations in a similar sense that like, operations is the physical component of the organization and so i think that people i personally think i don't know if you see it different i think people sort of push it to a side because it's not the the inspiring side of business where actually it's a fundamental component that if if you don't have it right you will know it and you'll feel that pain pretty quick

Yeah, absolutely.

And it's – well, it is exactly the point of this podcast, isn't it? It's turning that plan into actual reality.

There's no – you know, it's all well and good making the plan.

You've got to go and do the plan.

And I think that's where – that's why I've got into the areas that I've got into as well is because, you know, I – I looked around and thought, within those areas, well, where is it where a business owner is compelled to or mandated to being told or has decided themselves that it's essential for them to start looking at ops? Now, finance, if you're looking for funding, for example, whether investment or loans or debt or equity or whatever it is, or gearing up for sale or any of those things that I've sort of mentioned, then...

Things like finances is an absolute essential.

I suppose that's a really challenging thing to get someone, an owner or a board on board to agree to that because there's so much uncertainty and unknown about it.