So I wondered what pilgrimages have you been on to source these materials, and what are the most remarkable discoveries you've found as an artist?

I consider it research, and the travel is part of my research, and making the work on location is part of my studio practice.

The word pilgrimage doesn't really sit right [laughs] I feel.

At the same time, I've been to many places and specifically for a certain type of history and certain type of material.

I believe like all these places I've been to and the materials I find, the material is like a... almost like a compressed history and it's often informed by...

it could be like floods or droughts or plant life and movement, settlements, and just human movement I suppose.

So I think one of the most interesting locations, Safi for instance in Morocco, um, because it's really known for ceramic, um, tradition and a lot of both like contemporary local ceramic but also an export of ceramic.

And, and that was a challenge because of, of the kind of the, the kind of the constriction of it and also pre- presumably the fact that it's such a historic site.