To go through each of those investigations for your family to wait and to hope for developments, what impact did that have on you as children and indeed your mother over the years? I

suppose initially we were relying on the Gardaí to do their job because we had great faith in the Gardaí and the operation of the state to bring the killers to justice.

And it was only in 2007 when I was approached by journalist Barry Cummins and asked if he could write a chapter in a book called Unsolved about my dad.

And Barry uncovered some unsettling things for us.

He found that there was material evidence like a helmet, a newspaper that there was fingerprints on and that there was indeed fingerprints taken off several items in the secondary getaway vehicle.

And we were never made aware of any of this.

In fact, we were just told that the investigation was ongoing.

Does that apology help in that process at all?

Did you think it would take this long to get to this point?

I suppose that, you know, the first thing I'd like to acknowledge is that the Taoiseach Micheál Martin had astonished Simon Harris.

have showed real political courage and leadership in agreeing to this apology today.

And, you know, I'd also like to acknowledge the work that Jim O'Callaghan has done as Minister for Justice on this issue over the last 12 months.

But look, we must lose sight of my dad in all this.

And at the time he was doing a really difficult job for the state at a difficult time in our history.

And, you know, for that he was awarded the Prison Service's Highest Bravery Award.

But tell us about that first investigation because the serious crime review team that looked at it found that it was fundamentally flawed.

particularly because

Gerry Adams was with us and his assistant was with us.

And I always had the belief that, you know, there was one or two people who knew where we were gone that day and who we were with.

So if that never happened to us, I knew Gerry Adams couldn't take that chance.

He got in the back of the van with his assistant.

And when we got into the back of the van, we were kind of looking around.

This is incredible.

Maybe just read it to us.

You've been fighting for justice for your father for so much of your life, and when you learned that the Taoiseach was finally going to apologize on behalf of the state, what did that mean to you and to your brothers?

Well, I suppose the Taoiseach's office, first of all, Will, the T-- as said, the Taoiseach's office confirmed to us on Friday morning that the, uh, state apology will go ahead on Wednesday.

And, uh, myself and my family would like to thank the Taoiseach, Micheál Martin, and Tánaiste Simon Harris for showing, you know, real, true political leadership on this issue and agreeing to the formal state apology.

And I also want to acknowledge the work and the role that Minister for Justice, Jim O'Callaghan, has played since he assumed office to get this across the line.

And look, the most important person in all this, Will, is my dad, and we mustn't lose sight of that.

He, uh, was doing a very difficult job for the state at a very difficult time in our history, and he was awarded the Prison Service's highest bravery award for doing that job.

Um, but it, this really does bring a huge, uh, degree of comfort to our family, especially to my mother, uh, as it officially recognizes the failings that occurred in those three separate Garda investigations and, you know, most importantly, the, the initial investigation.

Finally, what do you think your father would have made of this, that it took so long for the state to recognize its failings? Because he served the state with distinction.

What will this apology on Wednesday mean to you, to your brothers and to your mother?

Well, first of all, Audrey, I really would like to thank the Taoiseach, Micheál Martin and the Taoiseach Simon Harris for showing true political leadership on this issue and agreeing to a formal state apology.

And I'd also like to just acknowledge the role and the work that Minister for Justice Jim O'Callaghan has done since he assumed office to get this across the line.

and look the most important person in all this is my dad and we mustn't lose sight of that and he was doing a very difficult job for the states at a very difficult time in our history and he was awarded the prison services highest bravery award for for doing that job.

And look, it means a great deal of comfort.

It brings a great deal of comfort to my family, especially my mother.

That's, you know, the state are now officially recognising the failings that occurred in three separate Garda investigations, particularly that first investigation.

No matter the length of time that passes, a murder and a murder without accountability and justice, it leaves a great trauma behind for you and for your entire family and your mother in particular, Austen.

Yeah.

We're five years on at that point from your father's death.

Yeah.

Again, we kind of talked like the cold.

I kind of just knew that this had something to do with the 1985 prison escape at that stage.

But I had nothing to go on ever.

And, you know, the first time I heard anything about what might have been going on in Portlaoise, was when a former colleague of my dad's, who I knew from Portlaoise, and he was now working at Modge, told me certain things about what was going on in Portlaoise and how certain people were bringing weapons and ammunition into the IRA.

I used the word journey quite intentionally there, because your journey brought you to Gerry Adams, the former president of Sinn Féin, a man who denies that he was ever a commander.

know, being 30 minutes away from something so big, right? For people that don't know you or wouldn't have much insight, give us a brief explanation to yourself and into the idea of the book.

I suppose my dad was, a lot of the, even people in their 40s and 50s now, their memory is starting to fade about what Ireland was like in the 70s and 80s, I suppose.

And people tend to forget, like, I mean, the country was like, you know, the security services here in the state were being overrun.

There was bank robberies left, right and centre.

The IRA campaign was at its height.

The Northern Ireland were putting pressure on the southern, the lads in the south here to fund their campaign in the north.

And there was a lot of bank raids.

There