So why don't we sort of set the stage for the rest of the episode and Anuja, for listeners who may be new to DC Flex and Flex Mosaic, can you explain what Flex Mosaic is and what problem it was designed to solve for?

Absolutely.

So DCFlex, the challenge we were going after with DCFlex was, can we unlock existing grid capacity using flexibility as a characteristic of large loads? And Flex Mosaic is really what defines what that flexibility is.

So fundamentally, Flex Mosaic is a common language classification that gives people performance-based requirements on how to bring flexibility to bear.

And the reason this was important was because during the last year, as we were engaging with our members in DC Flex, We kept hearing this conversation that was a circular conversation where a data center would come to the table and say, I need to be connected.

And a utility would say, well, to be connected in the timeframe you need, we would be able to make it happen if you were flexible.

Then the data center goes, what do you mean by flexibility? What do I need to bring? And utility goes, tell me what you can bring to bear and I might be able to tell you if that's a good donor.

So Anuja, to the point that Cliff just made that things vary by region, how does the framework account for the fact that grid needs and vocabulary do vary by location?

So Anuja, um, you think it's important to distinguish between are the numbers real for data center load growth and are the utility planning numbers real? Can you unpack that for us?

Absolutely.

So, you actually set it up really perfectly, Stephen, when you were talking about what can the future look like.

And the two questions that's always in my head when somebody ask me the question about are the numbers real, one is, are the numbers real from the perspective of energy needs for the future of AI that we envision? So the underlying question there is-...

is there enough data to train new models? Is there enough new use cases we'll come up with to use those models? From that perspective, the answer is absolute yes.

The energy growth that we are anticipating, what Rob just mentioned, th- that number is absolutely real.

The second part of the question is the one that keeps the utility industry, uh, up at night.

How are you defining flexibility? And what flexibility attributes are you working on, and how can that actually speed up interconnection approvals?