So with all of those elements in there, I mean, do you feel like Maybe it's just an evolution that anesthesiologists will assume this role, or is it more politics as to why they haven't assumed this role, the politics between anesthesia and the surgical groups? Where do you think that fits in?

That's such an interesting question because it's probably a little bit of both depending on which system you're in.

But what I find so fascinating a lot of times as a physician, anesthesiologist, and then someone who stepped into roles in the last few years is is that when like people describe the life that we live inside of the OR.

And so when you're saying, when you come to the anesthesiologist as a consultant or an administrator, and you're asking for input, they're just telling you about their everyday life and what they see happen.

And sometimes that's so easy.

It just so easily flows in the conversation that it's, it's like, refreshing and surprising all at the same time.

And so I think that there is so much value in having those conversations from the leadership perspective, whether you are an individual hospital system and that your C-suite is engaging with your anesthesia local providers or whether it's a system, a health system engaging with a nationally based anesthesia management company.

What is that ideal anesthesia leadership look like?