Uh, y- I'm sure you have a perspective on what we're talking about, but it might be good to just maybe start, if you would, about what your company is, and what purpose it serves in this world of role.

Yeah, absolutely.

So the easiest way to think about CreativeX is we're an observability layer for creative.

So our job is to essentially understand every single creative decision you're making across all different types of content, whether that be your branded content, increasing your creator content, your gen AI content, make sure that that content is in line with your strategy, it's executed as effectively as possible, and helping you get as much of an understanding of every creative decision you're making, and the performance impact of that decision.

Now, what Daniele is talking about is, has been a big shift in the industry, where as money has started to flow towards creator, some of the observability and visibility into how that money is actually needing to impact has been a blind spot.

And so our role here has been around how do we bring the same rigor that we've gotten used to with brand advertising into creator, so brands can actually get a unified view of everything they're doing to promote their, their brands and to deploy their strategy.

Anastasia, how do you work with a company like Nestlé? Are you part of that infrastructure, but I'm guessing not all of it? Like, I don't- what roles do you play and not play in terms of facilitating brok- deals and finding creators versus just helping brands understand what's working, what isn't?

Yeah, absolutely.

It But I agree wholeheartedly when you're talking about consistency, that over time, you can steer someone towards something and it will feel, no matter how crazy, it will feel core.

That's right.

And this is actually one of the biggest problems I think we have today, especially because content production and advertising production is increasingly being outsourced.

And it's being outsourced to either creators...

Or it's being outsourced to the machines.

And so what's happening is before, it was almost like a factory line supply chain where someone would come up with a brilliant creative idea or the nugget of a creative platform.

The brand would sort of take it.

There's so much in that,

So just explain what that creative quality score was that you were adding into Peter's model.

Yeah, absolutely.

So when we see most brands start to get into the territory of creative effectiveness and creative measurement at scale, the challenge is really how do you get all the creatives in one place and start to measure them for something in a way that brings the whole organization behind? And there are lots and lots of things that you can measure in the creative, but the challenge is, you know, how do you measure something that's not going to alienate part of your team? Because creative measurement, whether we like to admit it or not, is a very controversial topic organizationally.

Oftentimes, you know, I think about the hard part about this is actually not the tech, it's the change management of getting your organization to think this way.

So what we've seen in over 50 global deployments is the first place to measure is something that we call the creative quality score.

And the creative quality score is a very basic, I think relatively uncontroversial way of saying, "Hey, we're not saying if this is great creative or not.

We're not measuring the creative idea.

If this kind of analysis is, is becoming more and more possible, well, what does this mean for the way we think about creative measurement, uh, and the way it combines with media measurement? So Anastasia, Ian, I mean, maybe just talk through the strategic shift we're starting to see with creative measurement, which is, as we've discussed, moving away from creative measurement being something that either happens as part of the development process or way, way after the campaign into something that's, that's more part of, of campaign optimization as you go to market.

So there's quite a big disparity there.

This is it, and I think this is where we, again, have to zoom out and look at, uh, our marketing effectiveness machine as a connected operation between the creative and content side and the media side.

And what you have right now is that these two sides are fundamentally pushing in different directions, and they're going to break your machine.

Even if you look at this and think about...

And by the way, here, we haven't even included the cost of production, the cost of, of your team's attention to make those ads.

But also, I think more importantly, let's think about it from a consumer point of view.

How many of those ads do we believe were in line with those two or three key big creative ideas or key communication point you'd wanted to land with your consumer when you set the strategy up in the first place? Increasingly what we're finding is a lot of these ads are what we call disconnected ads.

But actually everyone we're showing this to is, is, is actually quite concerned by what they see.

Like what was the spark that got you to start your current business?

When I left Google, and I was similar to you, the first company, I thought the achievement was starting a company, but you recognize very, very quickly that the actual achievement is building a business.

And these are two very, very different things, right? On very different timeframes and a very different level of commitment.

Yes.

And again, someone said this to me when I was first starting my first company, and I didn't quite appreciate the time, but they said, are you ready to work on this for the next 10 years? And of course, I was in San Francisco at the time where people were selling the startups for like a billion dollars, you know, 18 months after they started.

And I was like, okay, like, I'm going to be done with this thing in three years.

And lo and behold, you know, that is obviously not how it happens for most of us.

How do you keep the passion? Like, do you still feel small and still feel like there's like bigger dragons to slay? Or like, how have you sort of like brain hacked yourself for the next stage?