So how did you get into, you know, this love of, of going out on the trail or running for these long periods of time? [laughs]

My relationship with running has always been very complicated.

When I was growing up, it was the punishment that you got for doing your sport wrong, right? Like, you would run laps if you let the ball, in volleyball, you let the ball hit the floor, right? You would, in rugby, if you, um, you know, missed, messed something up, you were running laps around the field, right? There were...

It was always, like, punitive.

It was, it was never something that people really enjoyed.

It was like, "Ugh, I gotta run laps," right? Or else the warmup.

Um, so I didn't, I didn't love it at all, uh, until I was 26 and I was working in family law full time and experiencing from afar my parents' divorce with my two s- young sisters' custody battle, and then coming...

[laughs]