So I would love to hear what you tried that didn't work, but then also what you tried that ended up being successful.

Well, You know, in the beginning, when we first opened the first location in Brentwood, it was, you know, I had had stylists like come to my house, blow out my hair.

And I was like, first and foremost, I wanted to make sure you were like a really nice person.

If you weren't like really nice and friendly and personable, then… that was it because I just was like, this is not the kind of business because, you know, gotta love them.

But, you know, not every stylist, you know, also wants to like wash their own client and blow out their hair.

They like, you know, there's like a whole diva world in this salon world too.

And I was like, no divas here.

Brilliant.

i'll be canceled again yeah

So, so, you know, I dry bar was such a natural thing for me because I was fighting my curls my whole life.

And then, you know, creating this brand that was about, you know, creating the perfect blowout.

And then just like the whole facade around it, you know, is like a lot of like personal stuff was happening for me when we were in the real height of dry bar and like, you know, Our mother died very quickly of cancer.

It was very quick and very painful.

I got a divorce.

My son went into rehab.

messy.

So there's obviously some correlation between that and the product.

Yeah.

I mean, it was a very like organic but windy path.

This, I mean, I did write my second book called The Messy Truth, which was, you know, kind of a... memoir, business, you know, amalgamation of my life and the ups and downs of building Drybar.

Every lesson I could think of, I put in the book.

And I always felt like I would write a book about it because I learned so much and I didn't go to college and I hadn't – I had really no business being at the helm of a company, but I learned it as I went.

And there was just so many valuable lessons that I wanted to put into a book.

I'll take that.

It is.

And like, you, if you are change...

It's like, if you brush your teeth with your right hand, start brushing it with your left.

Just, it just changes something in your brain, and I don't understand the science behind it, but, but at that point when I started, like, embracing all the stuff and reading about all this stuff, I was like, "Huh." Again, I will try anything.

I don't want to be this, like, sad sack of a person that I was.

And, and, and it really also came from my kids, who are very transparent with me, and we have very deep conversations all the time, and they were like...

I remember my kids saying to me once, and this was, like, such a pinnacle moment for me, 'cause they w- they said, "We don't know what version of you we're gonna get."

Yes.

Does it ever feel like a lot of pressure to build again?

Yes, it definitely is.

I mean, I think in the beginning when I decided to start Messy, which is quite a pivot from what I was doing with Drybar, you know, it was like... know for 16 years i built a brand about you know the perfect blowout and now i'm like well not so much anymore you know and so i you know i felt like it was good because it was so different and i and you know my advice to other entrepreneurs is always like you know take something and make it better you know and for me it was like learning to embrace this hair instead of like the perfect blowout um but there is a lot of pressure because you know what I don't want to feel like is like it has, you know, it's just Drybar is such a, as you said, an iconic brand.

Everybody knows it.

It's a household name.

And so to build another brand that has that kind of cachet is hard, you know? And I'm actually like, you know, Messi is about a year old and I'm learning that.

I mean, when we opened Drybar, it was like there was nothing of its kind.

But I want to talk a little bit about that and what it felt like to kind of go through the process and also then to be open about the process.

Like, what got you into the haircare industry to begin with, and, like, where did it all begin for you?

Well, it really all began, you know, when I was a kid growing up in South Florida with, like, all the humidity, and my naturally wavy hair, which I now really embrace and love, hence Messy.

It was just really challenging for me.

And, you know, I d- I didn't go to college and just didn't feel called to that and went to beauty school when I was in my early 20s and just, I can make the argument, to learn how to blow out my own hair.

And I just always had this obsession with my hair and hair in general and blowouts.

And fast-forward to many, many years later, after trying many things and having many lives and careers, I had moved to LA when my kids were born.

Thought I was gonna be a stay-at-home mom, and, you know, arguably the hardest job that there is, you know, being a mom.

Yeah

I went to Spanish

River High.

You probably have heard of that.

I went to Cypress Bay.

Yeah, yeah.

Okay.

I know a lot of people in Fort Lauderdale.

think it's right that private equity has that kind of demonization given what it's doing to these brands?

How did Drybar come together? How did you actualize it?

Well, given my history in the salon industry, and I did get my cosmetology license when I was like 20, 21, and I'd spent several years working in traditional salons and then in New York City.

And then my ex-husband Cameron and I met in New York, moved to L.A. and had two boys who are now 18 and 20, which is just bonkers.

But I was the stay-at-home mom for the first five years.

I really thought, and it just goes to show, you just don't know until you try things.

I wanted to have a baby so bad.

And I loved staying home for the time that I did.

How can leaders create a culture of customer centricity?

What was the scrappiest thing that you had to do in those early days to make it work?

And any entrepreneur knows this.

It's like, first of all, you're doing every job and you're not paying yourself for any jobs.

I think that's like when I think about the scrappiness, it's like the hours and hours and hours that I clocked on the phone with like the cosmetology board with like, It's like trying to figure out what kind of licensing we needed because we weren't cutting hair.

But turns out you actually, you know, in order to just blow dry or even touch hair, you have to have a license.

And but there was, you know, it's such an antiquated like system and it's like a government.

It's just it was a lot.

So I think we've covered the reason why you got back into this space, but I'd love to hear from you what makes Messy so different from all of the other players in the space? Because hair care, as you know better than anyone, it's a very competitive and very concentrated space.